New UMass Basketball Podcast

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minutefanjsf
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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by minutefanjsf » Sun Jan 02, 2022 12:31 pm

vanmeter wrote: Sun Jan 02, 2022 10:41 am Players under McCall have regressed. Both Pierre and Weeks were better their freshman year. In addition he has whiffed consistently on transfers.

In addition Ford added transfers who were productive;
Forbes
Brower
Life
Gaffney

Lowe and Harris had excellent 4 year careers and Dante Milligan improved under Ford. Lasme developed into Player of Year and while Freeman's stats declined his last year it was largely because the team around him was better.
I don’t disagree, fully. I think Weeks is a better all around player now and believe Pierre would have been even more so if his role had been changed. That is not what my point is. Ford is a better coach. He can get players to perform well, like you said Freeman’s individual stats declined because the team was better. Lappas was referring to long term planning with players and seeing their development as part of a team developing. Ford relied on transfers instead of this method. Lowe and Harris improved within the Ford system, yes. Under DK not so much. McCall seems to want to want to develop players to fit roles long term and not rely on transfers. Pierre is an excellent example of this. McCall assumed and asserted Pierre had developed. So, either the scheme was wrong or Pierre didn’t develop. McCall rewarded Pierre for sticking with him. The development of team is what McCall is missing. Playing 10 guys and no one knowing who will play when is missing. It may be something that isn’t done any more well. The 90s teams fro example had guys that were role players early and became go to guys without a drop off in team performance. They were not just rewarded for being on the team for four years. Obviously, every player has a ceiling, recognizing that ceiling and getting all the players to it and then putting the pieces together is what McCall isn’t good at. I don’t think Ford was there long enough to do it and he relied on transfers mostly. DK was not good at it either.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by kdogg8173 » Sun Jan 02, 2022 2:13 pm

McCall isn’t trying to rely on transfers but 5 of the top 6 player minutes are to transfers. Sorry but you’re not even factually making sense. McCall like any coach has been taking transfers in to improve the team and his rate is no different and may even be higher than Ford. The reason Ford sticks out is because his transfers were big contributors.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by minutefanjsf » Sun Jan 02, 2022 8:55 pm

kdogg8173 wrote: Sun Jan 02, 2022 2:13 pm McCall isn’t trying to rely on transfers but 5 of the top 6 player minutes are to transfers. Sorry but you’re not even factually making sense. McCall like any coach has been taking transfers in to improve the team and his rate is no different and may even be higher than Ford. The reason Ford sticks out is because his transfers were big contributors.
Right. We agree. McCall doesn’t want to rely on transfers. He has waffled from going all homegrown to transfers every other year. I think the transfer path is very different now as well without having to sit and the virtual free agency allowing players to go somewhere with a bulk of their college career left. So, McCall may be in somewhat of a hybrid mode of team development that he can’t really figure out. With the one and ones and everyone thinking they deserve minutes and the one free pass to transfer it may not be possible to build a team the “old way”. Kolton Mitchell may be on that trajectory and okay with his role hoping it pays off when he is a senior.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by InnervisionsUMASS » Mon Jan 03, 2022 8:42 am

The Lapp Pod was a great listen.


-The LC/Deli player development stuff was fascinating. I agree with him about the LC potential, but it would have never come to fruition anyways due to his knees.

-His commentary on Maxwell and how the Ford staff treated him was also very fascinating... sounded like he kept in close contact with MM and knew the stuff going on.

-Briggs... bet most here forgot about him. What a shame.

-The Gary Forbes bombshell was something... did the Lappas staff lay the groundwork for TF landing GF? They didn't get too much further into that, so we didn't quite get the word that Carter had initiated conversations with GF. If so... whoa!

-I would have liked to hear what Lappas thought of Willie Jenkins and why he left, same with if he tried to get Eddie Basden to keep his commitment.


Overall some great stuff... listen if you haven't already!
Stop waiting for UMass to do something big and help UMass do something big. - Shades

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by Juice Stand » Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:56 am

I just finally got a chance to listen to the whole thing, and this is a must-listen for UMass fans. Listen here in case you have trouble tracking it down: https://anchor.fm/umass-basketball-podcast

I know there are some real Lappas haters around here, and I never got that. Lappas is 100% on the money: he needed one more year. The pieces were in place for success. I wasn't watching the team then as closely as I do now, but I certainly remember thinking that they were on the upward trajectory and a little surprised and disappointed that he was canned. For the McCutchen haters around here, there's some juicy bits about their relationship, or lack thereof, and McCutchen's feel for the trajectory of the team, or lack thereof. He talks a little bit about the Mullins Center too, and the problems with attendance in that building.

Of course this is all just Lappas' opinion, and there are two sides to every story, but I happen to agree with the on-court stuff. I have no visibility into the off-court stuff.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by Roadtrip » Mon Jan 03, 2022 1:25 pm

December 21, 2002; Springfield Civic Center, Lafayette 54 UMass 52. The start of my eternal Lappas hate.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by LS71 » Mon Jan 03, 2022 1:37 pm

^ I am sooooo with you on that! :twisted:

I met him while he was here and he seemed to be a decent enough guy, but as a UMass coach....NFW!

Even the win over puke-on couldn't completely wash the stink of that loss away.
"Win without boasting, lose without crying." -- Julius Erving

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by 69MG » Mon Jan 03, 2022 4:10 pm

I never thought he was a horrible coach, I just hated all those boring games with scores in the 50's.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by Berkman » Mon Jan 03, 2022 4:28 pm

I will say this much about Lappas. He was always friendly and sociable. His assistants were the worst for being friendly. Could not engage them in any conversations.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by Sheck » Tue Jan 04, 2022 2:42 am

Juice Stand wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:56 am I just finally got a chance to listen to the whole thing, and this is a must-listen for UMass fans. Listen here in case you have trouble tracking it down: https://anchor.fm/umass-basketball-podcast

I know there are some real Lappas haters around here, and I never got that. Lappas is 100% on the money: he needed one more year. The pieces were in place for success. I wasn't watching the team then as closely as I do now, but I certainly remember thinking that they were on the upward trajectory and a little surprised and disappointed that he was canned. For the McCutchen haters around here, there's some juicy bits about their relationship, or lack thereof, and McCutchen's feel for the trajectory of the team, or lack thereof. He talks a little bit about the Mullins Center too, and the problems with attendance in that building.

Of course this is all just Lappas' opinion, and there are two sides to every story, but I happen to agree with the on-court stuff. I have no visibility into the off-court stuff.
The podcast was a great listen, and I do agree to a point to what Lappas said regarding the attendance struggles. In the early days of the Bill you had people willing to drive 2 hours each way to go to a weeknight game cause UMass was the top team (or one of the top teams) in the country, and that a good but not elite UMass team would still struggle to sell out the building. While that is true, the student attendance was really bad. I think you could count the number of people in the student section during most of the home games; there weren't many of us (exception being the UConn game and 1 other game where the Red Sox World Series trophy made an appearance, I think it was against URI). Meanwhile the students were going to the hockey games.

But either way Lappas was given that '04-'05 season to get either to the NIT or NCAAs or he was gone. They beat UConn and then followed it up with a stinker at Miami losing by 27. Then beat a ranked GW team on the road but later lost at Fordham. One and done in the A10 tournament. They get 2 more wins that year it's probably enough for an NIT bid and Lappas gets another year and the upward trajectory likely continues. But as it stood the fanbase had enough at that point (many wanted him gone after '03-'04) and there would have been uproar if Lappas had been given another year. It's unfortunate it didn't work out cause I do believe Lappas was genuine when he said he didn't have designs on coaching anywhere else. I was actually not aware he stayed in Amherst for 5 years after UMass fired him.
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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by Quann » Thu Jan 06, 2022 7:08 pm

Berkman wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 4:28 pm I will say this much about Lappas. He was always friendly and sociable. His assistants were the worst for being friendly. Could not engage them in any conversations.
Met him at the Hangar once after a basketball show. He said hello to our group and seemed like a genuine nice guy.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by 69MG » Thu Jan 06, 2022 7:15 pm

Berkman wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 4:28 pm I will say this much about Lappas. He was always friendly and sociable. His assistants were the worst for being friendly. Could not engage them in any conversations.
Wasn't John Leonard's (hockey John Leonard) father an assistant for Lappas. Maybe he wasn't friendly (I don't remember) but I'm satisfied with his contribution to UMass.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by vanmeter » Thu Jan 06, 2022 9:47 pm

John Leonard was a nice person albeit pretty quiet. I think both he and Lappas would have stayed here forever. I think Leonard still lives in Amherst and kudos to him for getting his older son to play hockey for a college that let him go.
John McCutcheon was a wonderful person. I think he was under a lot of pressure from people to get rid of Lappas - myself being one of them. In retrospect I wished myself and others I know wished we had been a little more patient with Lappas. He did whiff completely on Willie Jenkins snd Rhymer snd Brand struggled on his tutelage, but with Lasme, Freeman, and Austria who he had signed, I think we would have a pretty good team in 05/06. If it is true he was instrumental getting Forbes I think he may have been able to build a solid program.I also think expectations then and certainly in the Bruiser Flint era, were so high, it made matters even more difficult for them.
The cavernous Mullins center - great when your a top 20 team and can fill it, becomes an obstacle when half filled as the building doesn’t resonate and can appear somewhat empty. In all the years following UMass I regret not being more supportive of him.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by minutefanjsf » Fri Jan 07, 2022 10:11 am

vanmeter wrote: Thu Jan 06, 2022 9:47 pm John Leonard was a nice person albeit pretty quiet. I think both he and Lappas would have stayed here forever. I think Leonard still lives in Amherst and kudos to him for getting his older son to play hockey for a college that let him go.
John McCutcheon was a wonderful person. I think he was under a lot of pressure from people to get rid of Lappas - myself being one of them. In retrospect I wished myself and others I know wished we had been a little more patient with Lappas. He did whiff completely on Willie Jenkins snd Rhymer snd Brand struggled on his tutelage, but with Lasme, Freeman, and Austria who he had signed, I think we would have a pretty good team in 05/06. If it is true he was instrumental getting Forbes I think he may have been able to build a solid program.I also think expectations then and certainly in the Bruiser Flint era, were so high, it made matters even more difficult for them.
The cavernous Mullins center - great when your a top 20 team and can fill it, becomes an obstacle when half filled as the building doesn’t resonate and can appear somewhat empty. In all the years following UMass I regret not being more supportive of him.
Sounds like chasing the dragon IMO. If McCutcheon was as absent as Lappas indicated, and you and others convinced him to get rid of Lappas, he is not a wonderful person. One doesn’t leave their morals at the door when at work. To fire someone he didn’t interact with at the highest level program at the school is a bit morally bankrupt, IMO.

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Re: New UMass Basketball Podcast

Post by vanmeter » Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:41 pm

When a new AD comes in, they inherit all the coaches that were hired by someone else. In many instances, they make changes feeling less of an allegiance to someone that somebody else put in. I am not saying this is right or wrong but it happens quite a bit.

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