Conference Realignment

Get ready for some MACtion
dennisdent
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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by dennisdent » Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:21 pm

Chill dude and take a deep breath, we're also UMass fans here!!! :shock:

You wrote football coaches! :lol:

Where do you think a future UMass coach and staff my come from--not just the FBS ranks. There are much tougher jobs out there with less resources (40mil football performance center; new indoor facility; upgrades to the weight room).

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by McKinney » Tue Oct 26, 2021 4:22 pm

Some MAC schools (University of Akron for example) are in dire straights with financial hardship and large drops in enrollment. It's something we've seen here in New England with our own regional schools like Hampshire, Mt. Ida, Becker College, etc.

I wouldn't wish this on anyone's alma mater or employer. But it gives the MAC the opportunity to stretch towards the east with a focus on basketball schools with strong academics. I think it's for the better of MAC members like Miami, Buffalo, Ohio, and potentially UMass.

Inevitably part of the move to the MAC is a recognition that football drives the bus. A fear that the A10 is in threat of a Big East raid and is no longer worthy of sacrificing football. (In my mind FBS Independence is not that much of a sacrifice and think a raid is premature, but I'm clearly in the minority here)

To whatever extent the MAC is comfortable adding Olympic sports full members (non-football), might as well leave an open offer to teams in the A10 should they be raided.

The A10 may try to reload or some teams may defect to CAA, Patriot League, etc. But I think it’s a fair offer. A10 schools get a safety net (with probably a pretty decent media deal). MAC improves basketball and protects itself from their regional schools closing/merging. For UMass it'd be really great to at least get URI on board.
Class of 2019 - @StatsMass

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by Upstate10 » Tue Oct 26, 2021 4:46 pm

Yeaaaahhh we aren't getting into a conference.

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by Steve81 » Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:25 pm

I'm done with basketball and hockey season tickets and donations to hockey and un restricted fund. Everyone is entitle to an opinion. Will vote with my wallet. Real same as been giving for a quarter of century. But will be done with this crap. Most football only are short lived except for Hawaii and service academies. Obviously that means leaving the A10. Otherwise it's all lipstick on a pig.
Go UMass!!

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by jjmc85 » Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:38 pm

dennisdent wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm ^ You know what is a "tough job" being a soldier/Marine in combat. Being paid almost 700k and a Longmeadow Country Club membership is not a "tough job!" It may be a challenging job but not tough. I thought football coaches were supposed to be tough but we got Mr. Nice Guy and his skinny suits.
Sorry you misunderstood. The phrase “in the nation” has meaning in college Athletics. It is restricted to college Athletics and usually that sport. For example if someone says “Alabama is the best team in the nation” they don’t mean they’re gonna beat the Buccs (or any other NFL team for that matter). As another example if an announcer says “he leads the nation in passing yards” it is understood that they are excluding professional/high school/ pop Warner/video games/etc. When that phrase is used on a message board dedicated to a college football team, it is used in that context. To put it more bluntly it meant in division 1 football.
UMass Football: 22-3 at home when I was a student.

Leave the A-10!

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by jjmc85 » Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:40 pm

Steve81 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:25 pm I'm done with basketball and hockey season tickets and donations to hockey and un restricted fund. Everyone is entitle to an opinion. Will vote with my wallet. Real same as been giving for a quarter of century. But will be done with this crap. Most football only are short lived except for Hawaii and service academies. Obviously that means leaving the A10. Otherwise it's all lipstick on a pig.
I don’t see what your basketball or hockey tickets have to do one way or the other with football. I guess maybe I could see basketball if you’re mad about A-10 over MAC but that decision was also made what-7 or 8 years ago? What does hockey have to do with any of this?
UMass Football: 22-3 at home when I was a student.

Leave the A-10!

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by Upstate10 » Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:45 pm

If Bamford publicly announces we are staying put where we are he should hang up his UMass tie clip the same day.

Let somebody else make the next football and hoops hires and hopefully it’ll be an individual who isn’t afraid to rock the boat a bit. Bamford belongs at an Ivy or Patriot Leavue school. Not in big boy athletics.

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by TruBluMaroon » Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:47 pm

jjmc85 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:40 pm
Steve81 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:25 pm I'm done with basketball and hockey season tickets and donations to hockey and un restricted fund. Everyone is entitle to an opinion. Will vote with my wallet. Real same as been giving for a quarter of century. But will be done with this crap. Most football only are short lived except for Hawaii and service academies. Obviously that means leaving the A10. Otherwise it's all lipstick on a pig.
I don’t see what your basketball or hockey tickets have to do one way or the other with football. I guess maybe I could see basketball if you’re mad about A-10 over MAC but that decision was also made what-7 or 8 years ago? What does hockey have to do with any of this?
? Hockey wins a National Championship and then all the other sports think they can ?

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by dennisdent » Tue Oct 26, 2021 9:05 pm

jjmc85 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:38 pm
dennisdent wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:46 pm ^ You know what is a "tough job" being a soldier/Marine in combat. Being paid almost 700k and a Longmeadow Country Club membership is not a "tough job!" It may be a challenging job but not tough. I thought football coaches were supposed to be tough but we got Mr. Nice Guy and his skinny suits.
Sorry you misunderstood. The phrase “in the nation” has meaning in college Athletics. It is restricted to college Athletics and usually that sport. For example if someone says “Alabama is the best team in the nation” they don’t mean they’re gonna beat the Buccs (or any other NFL team for that matter). As another example if an announcer says “he leads the nation in passing yards” it is understood that they are excluding professional/high school/ pop Warner/video games/etc. When that phrase is used on a message board dedicated to a college football team, it is used in that context. To put it more bluntly it meant in division 1 football.
I was just kidding around about it because of all the on-line chatter how "tough" the UMass job is for Bell. My sarcasm was directed towards Bell and his comments today--that he quickly walked back later on twitter. UMass football has had a storied history in New England college football and to see it being made into an excuse filled joked, just rubs me wrong.

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by Worcester_To_Amherst » Wed Oct 27, 2021 7:36 am

Bamford better knock off the coy BS, especially after he clearly reprimanded Bell yesterday for his comments. UMass football fans are a forgiving bunch, otherwise we’d have abandoned the program long ago. If the options are CUSA in all sports or stay independent, I feel like the vast majority of UMass athletics fans are OK with not making that leap.

What he needs to be fighting for and communicating for the fan base is CUSA football only or all athletics to the MAC. I don’t mind staying independent in FB, taking the few ass kickings for paychecks and filling out the schedule with local teams (FBS/FCS) along with other mid-tier programs, as long as the team is decent. But Bamford and Bell have both said not having a conference is detrimental to the competitive advantage, so if we can’t have success as an independent (as they are implying) then they need a conference.

Personally I didn’t want to see all sports go to the future version of the AAC. Certainly won’t support all sports to CUSA. My choice of options that could be realistic are all sports to MAC or football only somewhere else (CUSA seems to be the only option there).

But if this all plays out with UMass stuck in the same spot, Bamford needs to go because he’s talked his way into a corner here. And the longer he stays mum the more the fans will expect and the angrier we will inevitably be when he fails to deliver and tries to polish that turd with his company happy speak.

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by jpatsfan » Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:28 pm

Worcester_To_Amherst wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 7:36 am Bamford better knock off the coy BS, especially after he clearly reprimanded Bell yesterday for his comments. UMass football fans are a forgiving bunch, otherwise we’d have abandoned the program long ago. If the options are CUSA in all sports or stay independent, I feel like the vast majority of UMass athletics fans are OK with not making that leap.

What he needs to be fighting for and communicating for the fan base is CUSA football only or all athletics to the MAC. I don’t mind staying independent in FB, taking the few ass kickings for paychecks and filling out the schedule with local teams (FBS/FCS) along with other mid-tier programs, as long as the team is decent. But Bamford and Bell have both said not having a conference is detrimental to the competitive advantage, so if we can’t have success as an independent (as they are implying) then they need a conference.

Personally I didn’t want to see all sports go to the future version of the AAC. Certainly won’t support all sports to CUSA. My choice of options that could be realistic are all sports to MAC or football only somewhere else (CUSA seems to be the only option there).

But if this all plays out with UMass stuck in the same spot, Bamford needs to go because he’s talked his way into a corner here. And the longer he stays mum the more the fans will expect and the angrier we will inevitably be when he fails to deliver and tries to polish that turd with his company happy speak.
We need a major rest for the athletics department. We need a new AD that thinks big time and can get us to the next level. We also need a new FB and mens basketball coach. Doing nothing is not an option and if we are idle through this realignment then what the hell are we as a program and brand.

The other question is how involved currently is Marty Meehan. Feels like someone behind the scenes not Bamford is pulling the strings.

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by Steve81 » Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:33 pm

jjmc85 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:40 pm
Steve81 wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:25 pm I'm done with basketball and hockey season tickets and donations to hockey and un restricted fund. Everyone is entitle to an opinion. Will vote with my wallet. Real shame as been giving for a quarter of century. But will be done with this crap. Most football only are short lived except for Hawaii and service academies. Obviously that means leaving the A10. Otherwise it's all lipstick on a pig.
I don’t see what your basketball or hockey tickets have to do one way or the other with football. I guess maybe I could see basketball if you’re mad about A-10 over MAC but that decision was also made what-7 or 8 years ago? What does hockey have to do with any of this?
It's my money and if the depart does not support my views, they don't receive the cash, period. Again, Football only alliances do not work long term except for Hawaii and the service academies. This means when the right situation happens we need to leave the A10. Some had hoped early on the American or the mythical new eastern conference. Those options are gone and it's clear, it's the MAC or the flagship does not support football at the FBS G5 level. My donations will be impacted by the decisions. St. Louis will eventually be the 12th team in the Big East.

The 50 Million spent. 1/3 via significant donations was done like James Madison a decade ago on their stadium. To position ourselves worthy of being accepted into a FBS conference. Not enough for the American but paired with Western Kentucky, it's possible for the MAC. It's the only possible G5 conference at this point and not a bad fit with many good sports and a strong 1 bid conference with WK and UMass gets better. Currently they received 2 NIT bids. The money with the conference is 400% greater than the A10.
Go UMass!!

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by PreecherJenkins » Wed Oct 27, 2021 3:01 pm

How much would a new stadium cost? $125,000,000?

Here is how you fund it:

Increase Student fees for a football stadium to $500 x 25,000= 12,500,000 per year, do this for10 years, have the stadium paid for. Hell, do it for five years and get 62.5m probably builds a stadium.

Now who says yes!
"You are what your record says you are" Coach Bill P.

JUST SAY NO TO THE MAC

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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by McKinney » Wed Oct 27, 2021 3:16 pm

UMass does not need a new $125M stadium. Most colleges simply renovate their existing infrastructure. Very few "new" stadiums are built unless they're starting up a football program from scratch, or because of action by an NFL team.

McGuirk is a very solid base to build around. Unless it's structurally unsafe, the goal should to just get it up to a AAC/MAC/SunBelt quality. Fill out a lower bowl with a full concourse connected to FPC deck and concessions at deck level. This doesn't drastically change the capacity of McGuirk, but similar to ODU's renovation it emphasizes quality over quantity.

ETSU just built a stadium that includes all that + a pressbox + auxiliary infrastructure for $25M. Even if the cost of labor is more expensive in Mass, it's got to be far closer to that figure for some excavation and casting some concrete than demolishing and building from scratch.

But anyway, yes I'm with you. We need to show major investments in football if we want to ever have a shot at a conference. Just as Bell quoted the AAC commissioner.
Last edited by McKinney on Wed Oct 27, 2021 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Steve81
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Re: Realignment: Texas/OK->SEC; UCF, BYU, Ciny,Houston->BigXII-dominos

Post by Steve81 » Wed Oct 27, 2021 3:21 pm

PreecherJenkins wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 3:01 pm How much would a new stadium cost? $125,000,000?

Here is how you fund it:

Increase Student fees for a football stadium to $500 x 25,000= 12,500,000 per year, do this for10 years, have the stadium paid for. Hell, do it for five years and get 62.5m probably builds a stadium.

Now who says yes!
WTF are you talking about. No one said a thing about 125M. This had NOTHING to do with the department's inability to kick the decision down the road to leave the A10 and commit to the MAC. This is the realignment that will be with us a long time. Here is a poster's view on realignment and how it's now the time to move as the end game is here.
I believe all of this goes back to how I have consistently seen this particular round of conference realignment from the moment that was kicked off by UT and OU going to the SEC: this is the END GAME. The last line of my blog post on the day that the UT/OU/SEC story broke, to quote Doctor Strange: "We're in the endgame now."

I strongly disagree with a lot of the opinions that there's going to be more consolidation with the P5 in the short-to-medium term. I do NOT believe that there's an inexorable force that going to lead to a P4 with all having 16 (or more) members. Texas was the ultimate expansion prize and they are now off the table, which reduces the incentive for future P5 expansion dramatically. There is absolutely no financial reason for the SEC adding FSU/Clemson after having just nabbed UT/OU, any suggestion that the Big Ten can just add USC and a couple of other Pac-12 schools is nonsensical regardless of the money involved, and any "plan" based on convincing Notre Dame to drop independence hasn't worked for decades and it definitely won't work now with the newly expanded CFP on the horizon.

The overarching point is that I believe that we're going to enter into a long period of *stability* in conference realignment when this round is over. This means that if you want to make a move (whether a conference or a school), you're going to make it NOW.

That's why the Big 12 didn't just do a bare minimum backfilling in order to preserve the highest per school TV revenue share - they grabbed the 4 most valuable G5 schools immediately. Same thing with the AAC - it wasn't a bare minimum backfilling, but rather a wholesale raid of every C-USA school that was located in a major market. The Sun Belt saw an opportunity to go from being the raided conference to the raider conference and took it even though it may not impact their TV revenue at all (and may even reduce their per school share).

That's why I think the MAC will look seriously at expansion here, too. If they want to expand outside of their immediate region region, then this might be the last opportunity to do so for the next generation.

It's also why JMU and any other FCS school that has contemplated a move up to FBS is coming to a "Sh*t or get of the pot" moment. Whether the Sun Belt might not have been good enough for JMU 5 or 10 years ago isn't relevant in the current realignment environment. Instead, JMU is likely seeing that this might be their last chance to move up to FBS for the next generation, so it's a decision that needs to be made NOW.

That's my worldview on all of this and I believe that a LOT of college administrators agree with me. They're not seeing a world where there's a ton of conference realignment movement in the future where "Keeping your options open" or "That school/conference will be there in 5 years" are valid ways to approach this particular moment.

In a way, TV revenue is almost an overrated factor in this round of realignment. This realignment round is NOT about squeezing every TV dollar possible. To be sure, TV money is important, but you can see that conferences are looking more at the long-term strategic moves now as opposed to what their TV contract will pay for the next couple of years. The reality is that when the dust settles over the next few months, the conferences that we see today will be the ones that will be in place for a MUCH longer time compared to past rounds of realignment. There's a very different sense of urgency right now, so we're seeing moves that are much more on the aggressive side as opposed to the conservative side for all parties involved.
Go UMass!!

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