Open ended Recruiting(ish) Question

[eldonabe]

I hesitate to add this to the Frank Martin thread or the 2023 recruiting thread. And this could also be a pseudo 2023 Transfer thread too....

I have many concerns about the Frank Martin Coaching Method... specifically how much of a maniac he seems to be on the court. I have not heard any practice stories that are even close to the antics he performs during games, but it would not be far fetched to think he is (at some level) a lunatic at practices too.

Where am I going with this....?

There seems to be some level of frustration from the players when they are getting screamed at during games. This is in part what I see and from many stories of what others see and report here as well. Take a kid like RJ. IMO he is their best player and has the most upside. You can't tell me back channels are not in his ear about transferring to another school, and you can't tell me that how he is treated on the court is not helping to convince him to stay. I am very concerned about his future as a minuteman (staying here).

As we near the end of the season, many of these kids seem like they have tuned FM out when he goes on his rants at them. His own kid even looks like he is done with it.

This ties into my recruiting question because I would love to hear the sales pitch he is using on these kids? Do they not see any tape or talk to others who do not warn them about what they are getting into? I am getting ahead of myself, but I can see good recruits come in then leave after year one because of this stuff - Like RJ might do.





I will end with this: I am 100% for accountability and calling out play that does not meet the expected standards. Is FM a lunatic? Absolutely, that has ben his reputation for years and everybody should know that.... but in today's game, can you keep players with that kind of coaching style - especially if it does not equate to wins? This kind of throwback Bobby Knight stuff does not have to be tolerated as much as it used to and most kids today will not embrace it like in the old days. I grew up and played for two very tough coaches and I would not change it for the world. But neither of them would be able to get away with the stuff they pulled back then.


I am openly wondering if Frank was the right hire give today's player and the landscape as a whole. I already have a bad feeling like this is going to end like the Lappas experiment did.

I am still in Franks camp for the moment, but, if Gapare and Luis split (and others maybe) and we watch [another] floundering season again next year, it may already be time to call it.

[NilesGold]

^ You're asking good questions, and I'm concerned too, but I don't know that any of us will have any answers until well into the off-season and we see who stays.

[Roadtrip]

My concern is at the point where it is best I keep my opinions to myself.

[69MG]

I've been to a practice and he yells at least as much, if not more. The language is also much more colorful, but so was Cal's if any of you were able to attend one of his practices. That's the way he is and players more than likely know that when they commit. How much of it they can take is the question and that will be answered in the next couple of months.

Here are two more good questions. Senior day is Saturday. Isaac and Brandon are the only 2 players who have used up all of their eligibility. Noah and Wildens are the only others who could be classified as seniors.

Will they be honored? If so, does it mean that they are gone? If not, does it mean they are coming back?

[Jeff90]

Those that plan to play the extra year don’t get honored and at this point both Noah and Wildens know their plans. So yes the senior night will be very telling.

[Jeff90]

As to Franks coaching style and players leaving I’m concerned also. He has a track record of being able to recruit and find diamonds in the rough. The question is can he retain talent. Its a tough time in college basketball for all coaches with the portal and the generational attitude of players today. I did hear from a good source that at least a couple of players were upset with the playing time of the coach’s son. All that being said. If Frank keeps his top 5 or so players from leaving I will be impressed.

[NilesGold]

I've been to a practice and he yells at least as much, if not more. The language is also much more colorful, but so was Cal's if any of you were able to attend one of his practices. That's the way he is and players more than likely know that when they commit. How much of it they can take is the question and that will be answered in the next couple of months.

As abrasive as Frank's antics seem to me from the outside, I'm not entirely sure it does the same to the players. Wildens and Woodley (even though he's sitting out this year) both were with him at SC and could have gone elsewhere.

[Juice Stand]

I'm all for holding players accountable and I don't mind some of the yelling, as long it's instructive. The issue I see is that often times the yelling is not instructive. Telling a kid he's a bum doesn't do anything to help anyone. I think RJ is an intersting test case. Frank seems to be harder on him because he expects the most, or see the most potential in RJ. How does RJ handle that? I don't know, but correct me if I'm wrong, I believe he has some family ties to Frank Martin and has known him for a long time, much longer than just his recruitment and time at UMass. RJ is probably at the top of the list of people that knew what to expect from Frank.

One thing that the offseason will tell us is not only how effective Frank's style is, but also if the NIL collective is effective in retaining talent. They've given Tafara some money, and it sounds like RJ is a top priority. If we lose both, I'd lose some faith in the coach and the collective.

My concern is at the point where it is best I keep my opinions to myself.

Hard disagree RoadTrip. I love to hear all opinions, whether I agree or not with said opinion, but I'd be curious to hear your thoughts.

[Juice Stand]

...I did hear from a good source that at least a couple of players were upset with the playing time of the coach’s son...

Interesting...

[eldonabe]

As to Franks coaching style and players leaving I’m concerned also. He has a track record of being able to recruit and find diamonds in the rough. The question is can he retain talent. Its a tough time in college basketball for all coaches with the portal and the generational attitude of players today. I did hear from a good source that at least a couple of players were upset with the playing time of the coach’s son. All that being said. If Frank keeps his top 5 or so players from leaving I will be impressed.

If they keep their top 5 or so players we all should be stoked! They will be the ones who have the most opportunities to move if they want out.

As for BM's playing time, I am not surprised to hear that. That situation will clear itself up all by itself in about 2 weeks.

[Floyd]

There's something about Frank that players like or they wouldn't play for him. I think he gets on them to find out if they can't, or won't do what he wants. I'd imagine he'll address those areas this off-season and the roster improves. So I'm expecting more than 2 are gone