Game 15, 2022-23: at GW (1/7)

[ClubMan]

Frank is very well established and successful coach. There has to be a method to the madness of what he’s doing. I personally don’t agree with all of the decisions he makes, but I’m also not a D1 coach that has a proven track record of success, so I’ll reserve my opinions and trust in Frank and what he is doing. We need to give him time and trust in his process.

[vanmeter]

Players with talent who don’t get minutes transfer plain and simple. It seems that DD, Gaspare, and Luis are high ceiling players. Playing 10-15 minutes a game, on a very average team, is concerning.

[Camby4Life]

Players with talent who don’t get minutes transfer plain and simple. It seems that DD, Gaspare, and Luis are high ceiling players. Playing 10-15 minutes a game, on a very average team, is concerning.

Do you really think these guys were expecting to play 25+ minutes this year? I find it hard to believe Frank would sell that to them based on his coaching resume. 15+ years of playing a deep bench shows what these guys should expect. He’s not going to change now. Somehow our fan base on here hasn’t followed his coaching and life philosophies.

[dennisdent]

Frank Martin:

2012–13 South Carolina 14–18 4–14 T–12th
2013–14 South Carolina 14–20 5–13 13th
2014–15 South Carolina 17–16 6–12 T–11th
2015–16 South Carolina 25–9 11–7 T–3rd NIT Second Round
2016–17 South Carolina 26–11 12–6 T–3rd NCAA Division I Final Four
2017–18 South Carolina 17–16 7–11 T–11th
2018–19 South Carolina 16–16 11–7 T–4th
2019–20 South Carolina 18–13 10–8 T–6th
2020–21 South Carolina 6–15 4–12 12th
2021–22 South Carolina 18–13 9–9 T–5th
South Carolina: 171–147 (.538) 79–99 (.444)

Derrick Kellogg:
2008–09 UMass 12–18 7–9 10th
2009–10 UMass 12–20 5–11 11th
2010–11 UMass 15–15 7–9 8th
2011–12 UMass 25–12 9–7 T–5th NIT Semifinal
2012–13 UMass 21–12 9–7 T–6th NIT First Round
2013–14 UMass 24–9 10–6 T–5th NCAA Division I Round of 64
2014–15 UMass 17–15 10–8 T–7th
2015–16 UMass 14–18 6–12 T–10th
2016–17 UMass 15–18 4–14 12th
UMass: 155–137 (.531) 67–83 (.447)

[Camby4Life]

C’mon Dennis, I know you are smarter than this when it comes to hating on coaches. But are you really going to leave out the 5 KSU and 5 LIU years. Put those two resumes blind side by side and 100 out of 100 are picking Frank Martin.

[Not Trigger]

SEC verse A10

[dennisdent]

C’mon Dennis, I know you are smarter than this when it comes to hating on coaches. But are you really going to leave out the 5 KSU and 5 LIU years. Put those two resumes blind side by side and 100 out of 100 are picking Frank Martin.

No hate, weirdly alike, that's all.

[Worcester_To_Amherst]

Frank is very well established and successful coach. There has to be a method to the madness of what he’s doing. I personally don’t agree with all of the decisions he makes, but I’m also not a D1 coach that has a proven track record of success, so I’ll reserve my opinions and trust in Frank and what he is doing. We need to give him time and trust in his process.

I think the method to the madness is really Frank took over a lowly A10 program and now he runs it, and he wants to use his first year in part to coach his son during his final season. Frank is beyond reproach right now for something like this, other than the fans bitching. I’m ambivalent at this point. I wish it wasn’t happening but this is “part of the deal” with bringing Frank in to coach here. The guy does things his way and doesn’t seem to care about what other people think.

I don’t see BM as the reason UMass is losing these games. Would better lineups to start have given us a better chance against SBU and GW? Probably. But I don’t blame BM for the losses. He can play a role on this team, but it should be in practice and limited game minutes.

Honestly my biggest issue is Frank being so sensitive to people talking about this earlier in the year. You want to do something like this? Fine, but don’t be surprised when people want to talk about it, which is a natural thing in this situation. People were respectful at first and he had a fit anyways.

All that said, I’m still glad Martin is coach and I like the team. Win 2 this week and things are fine.

[Marty Peretz]

I wish it wasn’t happening but this is “part of the deal” with bringing Frank in to coach here. The guy does things his way and doesn’t seem to care about what other people think.

I guess this is my one issue. If in fact he's sacrificing wins to play his kid (and, to be clear, I'm accusing him of intentionally doing that), I'm not sure it's fair for us fans to just be OK with that being "part of the deal." The idea that you can make 1.7 million a year and somehow be beyond reproach is preposterous. I think Frank has dramatically retooled this roster for the better, but that doesn't mean we can't take issue with his lineups on account of him doing things his way. Part of doing things your "own (at times counterintuitive) way" is recognizing that it will come with criticism.

[eldonabe]

I wish it wasn’t happening but this is “part of the deal” with bringing Frank in to coach here. The guy does things his way and doesn’t seem to care about what other people think.

I guess this is my one issue. If in fact he's sacrificing wins to play his kid (and, to be clear, I'm accusing him of intentionally doing that), I'm not sure it's fair for us fans to just be OK with that being "part of the deal." The idea that you can make 1.7 million a year and somehow be beyond reproach is preposterous. I think Frank has dramatically retooled this roster for the better, but that doesn't mean we can't take issue with his lineups on account of him doing things his way. Part of doing things your "own (at times counterintuitive) way" is recognizing that it will come with criticism.

Great post Marty..... I am not quite at the point of "sacrificing wins for BM's playing time", but the kid is still playing too much. That team is playing 4 on 5 when they are on offense - he is no threat whatsoever.

It is a fine line between playing Gapare too much and not enough. That kid clearly has the potential, but his consistency is questionable at best.

As for the team's record, I have a hard time finding any extra wins if they played a shorter bench (or whatever personnel example you want to push). The team played awful at GW - AWFUL. No different combo of players were saving that game. They played bad defense, and for that 10 minute stretch in the first half, that was as bad an offensive performance from Umass as I have seen since the mid 80's (Sorry Tom).

I have already referenced this about 6 times since the Bonnies game.......... Jekyll and Hyde

They looked like an NCAA Bubble team against St Louis and looked like they would struggle to beat Amherst College against GW.

[RagingCager]

Some great comments concerning this topic; hard for me to maintain ambivalence now that we are in the midst of heated A10 play. Many seem to be in agreement that BM, best described as a fifth year practice level player, should not be starting or getting as many, if not more minutes than the younger more talented guys that are clearly ahead (or should be) on the “depth” chart. If this is concerning to many of us, it most likely is to some of the players as well. Many of these games can turn on a couple of possessions or a run in the first half as well as the 2nd….not having your best players (with respect to game circumstances) out on the floor at all times can affect the outcome of games, not to mention providing fans with a more exciting product while allowing your talented, high ceiling young players to develop and gain confidence on the battlefield.

We live in a different world today…. media sources provide immediate updates on players throughout the country, and those projected to possibly play at the next level are chomping at the bit to show what they can do…. they want to play, and gaining a well deserved spot in the starting line up is a big deal as well…. this is why one hates to even think about the revolving door transfer portal when you have talented young players and questions about playing time. Another interesting point brought up is the poor attendance at Mullins…. I remember the days when there wasn’t an empty seat in the house…. you had to know someone to get in. When people hop in their cars on a cold, dark New England evening to attend a game, why not play your most exciting, explosive players…. give the fans something to jump up and scream about, maybe they’ll come back with a friend or family in tow for the next game? We keep hearing about “the plan”…. building the foundation and future of the program; why not focus on the guys with the brightest futures while building a bigger in house fan base ? Hopefully, at some point soon, things will start to come together and we can all feel like we’re on the same page moving forward.

[dennisdent]

Great comments! Over the years UMass has missed on some players who didn't live up to their high school/prep school accolades. They ended up riding the bench and often leaving for other schools. They didn't start every game and second half of games all season when it became obvious they didn't have the talent to warrant starting or increased playing time. I'll call it like I see it: nepotism. UMass owes Martin nothing but the contract that he signed and I guarantee it didn't come with a play family members over better players clause.

[Roadtrip]

I am so damn glad I'm not the only one that sees this BS.

[inthescoop]

Nepotism goes a long way at UMass. I mean look at Ryan Bamford.

[eldonabe]

Great comments! Over the years UMass has missed on some players who didn't live up to their high school/prep school accolades. They ended up riding the bench and often leaving for other schools. They didn't start every game and second half of games all season when it became obvious they didn't have the talent to warrant starting or increased playing time. I'll call it like I see it: nepotism. UMass owes Martin nothing but the contract that he signed and I guarantee it didn't come with a play family members over better players clause.

Not for nothin but I called this after game 3 and I took a little heat for saying it. I did not use the exact word nepotism, but I did express my concerns that BM was getting 25 MPG and not putting up numbers that warranted that kind of run. I warned of how this could play with his teammates.

When the team is winning, this stuff means much less - It is a formula that is working. Best deodorant ever! Now that the dust is starting to settle and this team is showing its "warts" (oh boy did I get killed for using that word back in the 13-14 tourney season) this BM playing time thing means a lot more.

This is still a marathon and not a sprint; that said, it will be interesting to see if this becomes more of an issue over the rest of the year and if we lose any to the transfer portal as a result. This specific problem (if it actually is one) is only for this year so we will see how this goes.