Coach Frank Martin

Anything and everything that is UMass Minutemen Basketball.
pacman327
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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by pacman327 » Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:55 am

RELAX PEOPLE

inthescoop
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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by inthescoop » Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:56 am

eldonabe wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 7:17 am What is unfortunate is that Frank has put his son in this position.
Everyone here is hollering and yelling at about Frank but not thinking about the situation his son is in. I completely feel for the young man. Not a single "adult" here who is bashing Frank actually cares about BM and his situation. And if you say you do, then why do you continue to rage. I get it, no one likes a nepo baby, yadda yadda, but let's move on.

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Jackson96
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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by Jackson96 » Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:59 am

I don’t have much to say on this. It’s a little sad. A little weird. I also don’t necessarily think this is just about things being said about the players.

That’s all I’ve got. Ready for the next tip off.
"I wrote a column and it went national"

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by Marty Peretz » Tue Jan 24, 2023 10:54 am

inthescoop wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:56 am
eldonabe wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 7:17 am What is unfortunate is that Frank has put his son in this position.
Everyone here is hollering and yelling at about Frank but not thinking about the situation his son is in. I completely feel for the young man. Not a single "adult" here who is bashing Frank actually cares about BM and his situation. And if you say you do, then why do you continue to rage. I get it, no one likes a nepo baby, yadda yadda, but let's move on.
I agree fully and Brandon seems like a great kid. But serious question: if a fan takes issue with Frank playing the kid too much and says "Frank should pull Brandon for Dominguez or Gapare," is that "rage"? Sure, nepotism charges are often a bit much (though even those are directed at Frank, not the kid) but how precisely is a fan supposed to critique Frank over the decision to play Brandon without the kid's name coming up at all? This whole thing feels like an attempt to put fans in such a rhetorical pretzel that they're functionally silenced and unable to be anything but blindly robotic cheerleaders. "I don't like Frank's substitution there" you might say. To which one might respond "what about it do you not like?" (assuming more than one player was subbed on, which is often the case). "Uhhh, number 1. I think we'd be better off playing number 2 or number 45." Saying it that way makes it seem like you're almost being purposefully condescending because if you take Frank's "don't talk about my kid" logic to its logical extreme, well, I guess you can't even say the words "Brandon Martin."

If you search the kid's name on twitter you can barely even find anything because the first 50 or so tweets that come up are just random tweets by different people with the name Brandon Martin. As you scroll further, you eventually find this: "Brandon Martin has played 21 mins, barely touches the ball, and leads UMass in turnovers." Someone else says "Brandon Martin starting is already mind boggling." Another says "The only way I will ever root for Brandon Martin is academically. I want him to pass his classes so he can graduate and leave the school." Only the third one is problematic. It's a bad look. Don't tweet shit like that. But for Frank to insinuate that A) the other tweets are out of bounds and B) widespread is just plain wrong. It simply doesn't pass muster. And for him to suggest that those tweets are more damaging to kids than him F bombing them up and down the sideline is laughable. Kids are on social media, yes, but kids are also in practice with him and at games with him all the time. It's not exactly a cuddly environment.

Anyway, scroll down a bunch more and you'll eventually find this: "Brandon Martin with an awful pass. Keep your head up and look around." I mean is that a "personal attack"? Kids can be taught the difference between "fans are passionate and sometimes say things in the moment" and "once in a blue moon, a true asshole crosses the line; one is a part of life and the other is someone who you should ignore because he or she sucks and it's only words, after all." Conflating the two is wildly disingenuous and allows the coach's version of events to go unquestioned. If you believe that ABSOLUTELY ANY CRITICISM WHATSOEVER is out of bounds, just say it. Whether you're Frank or a fan on here. Make that case concretely. But don't buy into the narrative that this is widespread. In fact it's uniquely the opposite. Go search Kentucky twitter after they lose and come back to me.

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by Jack » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:11 am

Thanks for those 3 paragraphs. This is not Kentucky Basketball. Its year 1 and Frank inherited a mess that he didn't create and which he's cleaning up. We're 11-8 and 2-5 - hoping and expecting that we'll see improvement throughout the season. If you want to incessantly attack the Coach and certain players thats up to you. But the disproportionate stark raving lunacy from some of the comments on here is pretty hilarious and not in a good way.

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by InnervisionsUMASS » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:18 am

The extremes in this thread are un-fucking-believable.
Stop waiting for UMass to do something big and help UMass do something big. - Shades

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by Juice Stand » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:39 am

inthescoop wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:48 am I been saying it since day 1. Why can we not sacrifice ONE season of BM playing time for 5-10 years of a solid foundation and winning down the road? Why must we want so much NOW and not practice patience (the opposite of aggression) and be solidified and content down the road.
I find this line of thinking completely absurd. Not the concept that building something takes time, I'm on board with that (although I think the timeline should be slightly accelerated for a coach with his pedigree), but the suggestion that you simply choose to sacrifice a season. There is no guarantee that you get 5-10 years of success by sacrificing this year. If this season was intended to be a sacrifice, then I probably wouldn't have bought my season tickets knowing the coach was tanking for happiness (this is obviously hyperbole and sarcasm, I don't think he's actually tanking).

dennisdent
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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by dennisdent » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:42 am

Martin did not inherit a mess at all!!! If you think that you know nothing about UMass basketball. Greg Carvel and Don Brown inherited the mess.

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by RagingCager » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:47 am

Under no circumstance, at any time should a Div 1 sports program sacrifice the best chance to win league games due to circumstances easily remedied with sound reason and rationale. Passionate, knowledgeable UMass fans started to express concerns early on about the role Coach Martin’s son was asked to fill; many, if not most of us were hesitant to mention the player by name, as we knew it was a delicate, emotionally charged situation, and no one wanted to initiate a perception of disrespect to Coach Martin or his son. But, we are also very competitive, and want to have the best chance to compete and win league games with our best players on the floor at all critical moments of the games. Everyone could understand and appreciate why Brandon Martin was in the starting line up early on, as some of the other guys were learning the system and Div 1 A10 level play…. it wasn’t long however, before it was obvious to knowledgeable fans, that there were better choices for the regular 7-8 man rotation, including the starting lineup. As the team started to lag behind other well coached A10 teams resulting in disappointing results on the court, it was expected that Coach Martin would see and understand the same thing we all did and make adjustments with the starting and regular rotation lineups.

This is where the dynamic between Frank Martin the coach and Frank Martin the parent and father has clashed, resulting in a blurred perception and seemingly stubborn reluctance to initiate the necessary mid season adjustments, including his own son’s role on the team, resulting in his son being unfairly cast as a scapegoat for the teams recent struggles, when the criticism should be directed at the coach ( which in many cases, it has been). Respectful fans from earlier in the season have become more and more fed up and upset by the way this dynamic is playing out and affecting the team’s performance in A10 play, and some of the responses have crossed the line, as has Coach Martin’s reaction. He expressed his dismay of criticism directed towards the “children” on his team, when what he truly means is the attention directed towards his “child”. I don’t fault Frank Martin the loving father for looking out for his son…. he and Brandon should be very proud in the man Brandon has become and all his tremendous accomplishments…. I have a son too, I know how that works. The issue here, is that Frank Martin the coach has to find a way to separate himself out from Frank Martin the father when it involves critical decisions affecting the team’s ability to have it’s best lineup on the floor when it counts the most.

No doubt this is a difficult, emotionally charged issue on both sides, with a young man caught in the middle through no fault of his own….he deserves none of this; he is a good basketball player and I really feel for him…. he gives everything he has when asked and has been cast into a role that may be a bit unfair and unreasonable at this stage of the season. Brandon Martin deserves to be recast in a role better suited for him and the team.This matter is obviously more complex and emotionally charged than one may have originally thought or hoped, and perhaps asking for some outside help may assist in finding a middle ground in the clash between a proud father and a passionate coach.
Last edited by RagingCager on Tue Jan 24, 2023 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

inthescoop
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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by inthescoop » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:49 am

dennisdent wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:42 am Martin did not inherit a mess at all!!! If you think that you know nothing about UMass basketball. Greg Carvel and Don Brown inherited the mess.
Considering the fact that 9 out of the 12 players getting some type of PT are new this season, that is definitely subjective.

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by PreecherJenkins » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:55 am

Jack wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:11 am Thanks for those 3 paragraphs. This is not Kentucky Basketball. Its year 1 and Frank inherited a mess that he didn't create and which he's cleaning up. We're 11-8 and 2-5 - hoping and expecting that we'll see improvement throughout the season. If you want to incessantly attack the Coach and certain players thats up to you. But the disproportionate stark raving lunacy from some of the comments on here is pretty hilarious and not in a good way.
Tell us you have no clue about college basketball without telling us. He did not inherit a mess at all, it is a completely new team. Each year is going to be a new team. Coaches will have to re-recruit the players you want to stay in your program. Use the portal and freshman to supplement or compliment your roster. That is why this team's regression esp. on the defensive end through the first seven games of A10 play is so disappointing. The days of guys like Put, TV, Fredddddy, Chaz, Cady, Trey, Maxie staying 3,4,5 years in one place are over. The question this all comes back to is Frank Martin the right guy to lead an a-10 program in this new era?
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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by dennisdent » Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:09 pm

inthescoop wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:49 am
dennisdent wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:42 am Martin did not inherit a mess at all!!! If you think that you know nothing about UMass basketball. Greg Carvel and Don Brown inherited the mess.
Considering the fact that 9 out of the 12 players getting some type of PT are new this season, that is definitely subjective.
When those three players are Noah, TJ and DD with a clean, no drama program, a new coach should consider themselves lucky.

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by PreecherJenkins » Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:18 pm

dennisdent wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:09 pm
inthescoop wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:49 am
dennisdent wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:42 am Martin did not inherit a mess at all!!! If you think that you know nothing about UMass basketball. Greg Carvel and Don Brown inherited the mess.
Considering the fact that 9 out of the 12 players getting some type of PT are new this season, that is definitely subjective.
When those three players are Noah, TJ and DD with a clean, no drama program, a new coach should consider themselves lucky.
Of the guys who still could play who do we miss Javon? Maybe... Walker? Kolton Mitchell?
"You are what your record says you are" Coach Bill P.

JUST SAY NO TO THE MAC

dennisdent
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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by dennisdent » Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:24 pm

PreecherJenkins wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:18 pm
dennisdent wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:09 pm
inthescoop wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:49 am

Considering the fact that 9 out of the 12 players getting some type of PT are new this season, that is definitely subjective.
When those three players are Noah, TJ and DD with a clean, no drama program, a new coach should consider themselves lucky.
Of the guys who still could play who do we miss Javon? Maybe... Walker? Kolton Mitchell?
Javon! He's tearing it up in JUCO but not sure he could take Martin's coaching style. Walker, sure. Mitchell is MIA and unless is name is Kolton Mitchell Martin don't see him having much playing time. :lol:

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Re: Coach Frank Martin

Post by PreecherJenkins » Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:38 pm

The other guy we are forgetting is CJ Kelly who would have been nice to had back along with Javohn

Matt McCall inherited a mess. Frank Martin did not.
"You are what your record says you are" Coach Bill P.

JUST SAY NO TO THE MAC

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