Umass and UConn Conference USA

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KahunaK
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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by KahunaK » Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:02 pm

These are just a few of the reasons why UMASS should NOT play Liberty in any sports!

Religious institutions like Liberty University and Wheaton College regularly suppress student and faculty speech

Sarah: They do. One of the examples Jones brings up in her post is Wheaton College in Illinois, which suspended political science professor Larycia Hawkins in 2015 for publicly stating that Christians and Muslims believe in the same god. As FIRE said at the time of Hawkins’ suspension, Wheaton College is a good example of what a warning school looks like.

Jones also discusses Liberty University, and points out that its president, Jerry Falwell Jr., recently threatened to have Christian author and activist Shane Claiborne, with whom Falwell disagrees on certain theological and political matters, arrested if he comes onto campus.

In 2016, we wrote about Falwell’s censorship of an anti-Trump article written in the student newspaper at Liberty University. (In fact, Falwell Jr. is reportedly censoring the student newspaper again, this time for attempting to write about Claiborne.) As we explained, Liberty’s written policy clearly elevates religious values above freedom of speech — which flies in the face of a statement Falwell made weeks before in which he claimed that “Liberty University promotes the free expression of ideas unlike many major universities where political correctness prevents conservative students from speaking out.” We wrote then that Falwell “cannot cloak himself in the mantle of freedom of speech while demanding censorship power over student press.” His words are empty until Liberty takes steps to actually promise students free speech rights in written policy materials. If Falwell wants to present his campus as open to dissent, Liberty’s handbook should reflect that. In fact, that’s why we launched the Leader Statement Database — so that students can keep track of what their college presidents and administrators say, and hold them accountable for the promises they make.

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story ... ell-215528

https://www.redstate.com/sweetie15/2017 ... -dealings/

https://www.thedailybeast.com/holy-hypr ... rostitutes

https://reason.com/2018/08/21/liberty-u ... censorship

https://www.thefire.org/is-speech-suppr ... ch-crisis/
https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktak ... ed-liberty

Jack
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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by Jack » Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:13 pm

Yet another moronic attempt to pretend that personal political opinions should dictate a football schedule. Let's not schedule Wheaton ...LOL !!!!! :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: Oh I don't agree w/ [fill in the blank university] policy on [fill in the blank public policy] I am totally incapable of dealing with the fact that other people have different political opinions than I do... ergo we should ban schools I disagree with from our football schedule. Hell, let's ban West Point and Annapolis b/c they are so warlike..... :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by KahunaK » Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:53 pm

Jack wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:13 pm
Yet another moronic attempt
Thank you for adding to this discussion in a mature and thoughtful manner. Dismissing people as moronic or calling the Washington Post moronic (a favorite word perhaps) as left wing lunacy (check some of the sources I quote) is poor reflection of your ability to have a thoughtful and engaging discussion. I do not call people names on this board nor do I ever try to belittle them. While I certainly do not agree with everyone's opinions I enjoy reading most of them so I can gain an understanding and appreciation of other people's thinking. You should consider trying that approach.

Liberty should be shunned not just in sports but by the whole academic community for its beliefs that undermine some bedrock beliefs of academia and the United States.

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by Jack » Sun Jul 28, 2019 10:11 am

KahunaK wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:53 pm
Thank you for adding to this discussion in a mature and thoughtful manner.
You are totally welcome.
KahunaK wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:53 pm
Dismissing people as moronic or calling the Washington Post moronic (a favorite word perhaps) as left wing lunacy (check some of the sources I quote) is poor reflection of your ability to have a thoughtful and engaging discussion.
You should focus more on reading comprehension. I did not dismiss any person as moronic. So please stop fabricating and misrepresenting what I stated. Indeed, the Washington post has become progressively moronic and unreadable since it was purchased by Jeff Bezos who has in turn morphed the formerly great newspaper it into a blatantly partisan political outlet for Bezos and Amazon. Please feel free to disagree with my opinion that we should not base our football schedule on Old Cage's political opinions - i am perfectly happy to have a thoughtful and engaging discussion. Let's tell Mr. Bamford that he is not allowed to schedule football games against opponents whose policies we personally disagree with.... lol :roll:

KahunaK wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:53 pm
I do not call people names on this board nor do I ever try to belittle them.


Good for you. Perhaps you think you deserve a medal. Despite your misrepresentation to the contrary. I did not dismiss anybody as moronic. However the notion that we should select football opponents based upon personal political opinions of the fans strikes me as completely moronic and absurd. I am perfectly free to have that opinion and to express that opinion. You are free to disagree w/me if you want to argue that Bamford should only schedule schools that you personally approve of - then by all means make that argument and I would be more than happy to debate that point with you.

KahunaK wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:53 pm
While I certainly do not agree with everyone's opinions I enjoy reading most of them so I can gain an understanding and appreciation of other people's thinking. You should consider trying that approach.
And you should consider taking your own advice instead of pretending that your role here is to give unsolicited advice. Why on earth would you advocate that we are all required to accept every cockamamie opinion that is expressed here? Lets see you try to gain an understanding and appreciation for this thinking: It would become a very boring forum if we all followed your foolish approach and sat here like imbeciles smiling and agreeing with every opinion that was expressed regardless of how moronic that opinion might be. Kapeesh?

KahunaK wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 10:53 pm
Liberty should be shunned not just in sports but by the whole academic community for its beliefs that undermine some bedrock beliefs of academia and the United States.
That's your opinion. Thank you for sharing it. I understand, appreciate and totally disagree with your opinion. Thankfully our AD Mr. Bamford also disagrees with your opinion as well and thankfully we'll be playing Liberty on November 2nd. I hope its as great and as entertaining a game as we had with them last season and I hope we beat them again. You are welcome to meet me in Yellow lot and tell me all about how great it would be to shun all the schools that you and I differ with for political and or philosophical reasons. Until then I will continue to express my opinions and hopefully you will want to have a discussion w/o misrepresenting what is actually being stated.

Have a great day - Go UMASS !!!! :D :D :D :D

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by Steve81 » Wed Jul 31, 2019 9:55 am

Perhaps here is not the best place, but originally thought a new East Coast league would never form because you'd give up CFP distribution money and a NCAA auto bid..

However in looking at ODU increase travel cost of around 1.5M from compact CAA to spread out CUSA, think it is no longer pie in the sky idea.
The reduction in travel costs would basically replace the CFP distirution money.
Plus the wording in the current CFP may allow the new conference to receive APR money at 300k per team.
It's the exit fees that would be an issue but now think it is possible.
Adding:
Think it's a long shot, but have been surprised by UConn and the Big East splitting into the New Big East and the American.
Conference USA $ 15,604,838
Mid-American Conference $ 14,129,881
Mountain West Conference $ 20,029,711
Pac-12 Conference $ 64,088,273
Southeastern Conference $ 83,620,675
Sun Belt Conference $ 17,079,796
Last edited by Steve81 on Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

69MG
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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by 69MG » Thu Aug 01, 2019 1:07 pm

I'll put this here. Not shedding any tears for UConn's D, or lack thereof.

https://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.c ... academics/

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by McKinney » Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:58 pm

^ Why is that even a national article? Must be a slow news day for NBCSports to be covering the grades of a football player at UConn of all people, places, and things.
Class of 2019 - @StatsMass

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by MajBugman » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:52 am

KahunaK wrote:
Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:02 pm
These are just a few of the reasons why UMASS should NOT play Liberty in any sports!

Religious institutions like Liberty University and Wheaton College regularly suppress student and faculty speech

Sarah: They do. One of the examples Jones brings up in her post is Wheaton College in Illinois, which suspended political science professor Larycia Hawkins in 2015 for publicly stating that Christians and Muslims believe in the same god. As FIRE said at the time of Hawkins’ suspension, Wheaton College is a good example of what a warning school looks like.

Jones also discusses Liberty University, and points out that its president, Jerry Falwell Jr., recently threatened to have Christian author and activist Shane Claiborne, with whom Falwell disagrees on certain theological and political matters, arrested if he comes onto campus.

In 2016, we wrote about Falwell’s censorship of an anti-Trump article written in the student newspaper at Liberty University. (In fact, Falwell Jr. is reportedly censoring the student newspaper again, this time for attempting to write about Claiborne.) As we explained, Liberty’s written policy clearly elevates religious values above freedom of speech — which flies in the face of a statement Falwell made weeks before in which he claimed that “Liberty University promotes the free expression of ideas unlike many major universities where political correctness prevents conservative students from speaking out.” We wrote then that Falwell “cannot cloak himself in the mantle of freedom of speech while demanding censorship power over student press.” His words are empty until Liberty takes steps to actually promise students free speech rights in written policy materials. If Falwell wants to present his campus as open to dissent, Liberty’s handbook should reflect that. In fact, that’s why we launched the Leader Statement Database — so that students can keep track of what their college presidents and administrators say, and hold them accountable for the promises they make.

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story ... ell-215528

https://www.redstate.com/sweetie15/2017 ... -dealings/

https://www.thedailybeast.com/holy-hypr ... rostitutes

https://reason.com/2018/08/21/liberty-u ... censorship

https://www.thefire.org/is-speech-suppr ... ch-crisis/
https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktak ... ed-liberty
Now do Evergreen University and Bret Weinstein. The first sentence of the Reason article you provided kind of undermines your argument that Liberty and Wheaton are the only two schools UMass shouldn't play. I am pretty confident conservative professors know they can't speak their minds at most universities or risk getting fired or facing protests which at the least undermine their ability to do their jobs and at most can threaten professors' families. Hell UMass shouldn't play itself in the spring game.

https://www.apnews.com/850642597e58465a94f5bb6451adf184

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/08/us/r ... llege.html

So if your concern is really that UMass shouldn't play any schools that squash academic thought and free speech, we should also say no if Cal or Wisc comes knocking, because this not only a problem on conservative campuses. But, I am thinking your real problem is the fact that Liberty is a Conservative/Christian University where the University President Support Trump and therefore not in line with your ideology.
Raise the bar, do the minimum.

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by KahunaK » Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:42 pm

[So if your concern is really that UMass shouldn't play any schools that squash academic thought and free speech, we should also say no if Cal or Wisc comes knocking, because this not only a problem on conservative campuses. But, I am thinking your real problem is the fact that Liberty is a Conservative/Christian University where the University President Support Trump and therefore not in line with your ideology.
[/quote]


^^^ WRONG. I abhor what goes on at UCal-Berkeley. I also abhor safe spaces and stopping people who have different points of view from expressing them. If you cannot bear to hear differing opinions you probably are not ready for college and you certainly shouldn't be running one.

The BIG difference is Berkeley has tenure for its professors and the college newspaper is independent and student run. I disagree with the Catholic church on many issues (I was brought up Catholic) yet I do not say UMASS should not play BC, Notre Dame, Fordham etc.

Liberty is run by a person who has professors on a year to year contract (no tenure) and the student newspaper is run by the faculty. Any negative news is censored. Liberty tries to control what people think and say and has the power to throw those people out. Liberty is a disgrace to higher education. Anyone who does not see that is willfully blind to what goes on there. It seems your ideology is getting in your way.

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by Jack » Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:03 pm

Kahunak i love your self righteous moral indignation but its time to draw a line in the sand...... I hereby demand that Ryan Bamford immediately cancel all scheduled football games against schools that don't offer vegan and gluten free options at their dining halls .... :roll: :roll:

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by KahunaK » Sun Aug 04, 2019 7:48 pm

^^^or only schedule teams UMASS can beat! :) :) :)

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by eldonabe » Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:21 am

If the school is sanctioned to play a sport, Umass should not be above playing them (with some possible very rare exceptions).

Sports and politics are getting too intertwined and it really sucks. I am not advocating the shut up and dribble mentality, but FFS it's a game.... let it be a game and not some social justice warrior commentary.

Instead of bitching about Liberty's politics, let's just burry them on the field and send them home with their tails between their legs. Maybe teams should not play Umass because we have a jerk-off professor who hates football ( I for the life if me cannot remember that guy's name now) or because the Boston Globe really thinks Umass is blowing too much money on Football... Opinions are like assholes..... everybody has one.

I don't agree with what Liberty University stands for either, but football/sport is not politics.
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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by InnervisionsUMASS » Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:58 am

^

THANK YOU!
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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by Quann » Tue Aug 06, 2019 1:38 pm

Preach Eldonabe. Preach!!

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Re: Umass and UConn Conference USA

Post by econalum » Tue Aug 06, 2019 10:34 pm

I am not a fan of Falwell, nor by extension Liberty.

With our 'limbo' status as an independent, IMO, UMass needs to be realistic and schedule who is available.

If folks feel strongly, let them picket. And then, count the ticket buyers/tV watchers vs. protestors.

My guess is that not enough folks care to protest in numbers.
Feeling entitled is JUST a feeling...

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