Presidential poll August

[umassfan.com]

I respect that comparison. Much more so than the "replace with black" or the individual trying to troll about grammar because their IQ is too low to form a logical response.

I think the issue here for me is change vs standard. We are talking about change from the cultural norm. In a large way because since this country was founded sex meant penis or vagina not an internal sense of gender. So what we have is divergence from cultural norm which offends the social mores of about half the country. (I will say half but truly I think when it came down to for example the beach scenario a large chunk of "liberal" dad's would feel uncomfortable. However for the purpose of this discussion I will use about half.

This divergence is being pushed for the social benefit of ~0.2% of the population. Their is a largely cited statistically irrelevant study to claim lack of safety. People ignore the facts that it has been used by men to gain entry into women's rooms (click links already souced). Then it is mentioned that transgender aren't unsafe and liberals attack saying you're prejudice or have hate because you feel your child would be unsafe.

The key to the beach scenario isn't safety, perhaps some people don't want their daughter seeing someone's penis in a changing room. It isn't about transgender people attacking, it is about predators using it to attack (which they already have again I already sourced 4 events above) and it is about the social mores of our society around the construct of modesty and sexuality.

The fact that liberals refuse to address this issue in these grounds is an avoidance. It is closed minded to refuse the opinion of another as ignorant. It is ignorant of oneself to do so simply because you have no response to their reasoning.

[R&G]

Your "beach scenario" almost has me convinced. It's certainly not bizarre or highly unlikely like the scenarios I mentioned in an earlier post. Now, while I'm a 51 year old pasty white man, I've probably been to the beach at least 300 times in my life and I've never used one of these facilities, I do not argue that they exist. What a convenience it would have been when I brought my kids to the beach in their Sunday best. And what parent wouldn't send their 8 year old child alone into a public area to change clothes in front of other naked people?
My only question is how would you propose that it be enforced? Perhaps you could have attendants checking genitalia prior to individuals being allowed to enter the facility. Or maybe just a sign as you suggest. That would certainly prohibit sexual predators from entering the wrong changing room.

[Berkman]

Isn't it time to shut down this title topic and move the discussion to a new topic?

[umassfan.com]

"Biologically male" [sic] trans woman -



"Biologically female" [sic] trans man -



I'll just leave this here for you. Who goes where?

(apologies for the size of the pics, will delete if requested)

I live in western ma with gay parents and have a trans friend I am not confused on the issues. He works at pride and can't afford surgery of any type so he looks like a female with short hair. That's just the fact on that situation. He uses the female bathroom always because as he put it, it doesn't bother him so why create an issue for someone else. The pictures you post are extremes to the point of being invalid, the guy at the bottom clearly could do what he wants without issue. The lady at the top most likely wouldn't be questions if she maintained a sense of modesty. The issue is that those are extremes and not at all representative of the average transgender individual.

I read all the links you posts, everyone already admitted not reading a single link I did. I just disagree with the issue. The people you posted are extremes, the average transsexual can't afford surgery. The fact you could makes you extremely lucky. You act like there is hate, there is no hate. You.and others in the thread have clearly shown hate for me, however my beliefs are based on nothing more than a belief in the rule of law and state governmental rights.

In Massachusetts we have a law that allows exactly what you want, I don't argue it's validity here. Do I like it no, am I voting for people who want to change it, yes. That is how politics work. Trump simply said let the states choose. This should be the case until Congress actually passes a federal law. Here is another idea along. those lines, if you live I a state that has a set of laws you don't like, move to another state. I fully plan to move to the Midwest or Carolinas/Georgia once my daughter is out on her own.

Your "beach scenario" almost has me convinced. It's certainly not bizarre or highly unlikely like the scenarios I mentioned in an earlier post. Now, while I'm a 51 year old pasty white man, I've probably been to the beach at least 300 times in my life and I've never used one of these facilities, I do not argue that they exist. What a convenience it would have been when I brought my kids to the beach in their Sunday best. And what parent wouldn't send their 8 year old child alone into a public area to change clothes in front of other naked people?
My only question is how would you propose that it be enforced? Perhaps you could have attendants checking genitalia prior to individuals being allowed to enter the facility. Or maybe just a sign as you suggest. That would certainly prohibit sexual predators from entering the wrong changing room.

With all due respect, it isn't just the beach, it could be Wal-Mart etc. As a father of an 8 yr old, I worry when my daughter goes into the bathroom and I have to wait outside. Regardless of above issues. Moving on from that, I know that everyone likes to act as though the scenarios I posted aren't real. However I linked above to 4 different cases of exactly what I was talking about. So If you aren't going to view the evidence you have no right to attack the claim. These situations are very easily found with a google search but I provided the first 4 on Google for you. Didn't even need to leave page 1.

As far as enforcement that is tough, I imagine much like it would be treated if a male just walked into a female locker room who wasn't transgender. However Most of our laws do not need enforcement, people follow them because they are the law. Are their people who don't? Yes. However, it wouldn't be difficult to deal with especially in the age of cell phones.

[umassfan.com]

Source peer reviewed scientific documentation for you claim please.

[DEM]

Speaking of polls, the Democratic Party as a whole is now less popular than Trump, Pence, the GOP as a whole, and the corporate media. The ones that they narrowly beat out in this poll were Hillary Clinton and congress as a whole. Pretty bad. They simply haven't learned from their defeat. At this point, the Democratic Party establishment appears incapable of even a symbolic change in direction, for example by nomination of Keith Ellison as head of DNC (instead, they again went with the corporate candidate, Hillary Clinton/Barack Obama favorite Tom Perez). Additionally, in my opinion, the democratic party is spending too much time accusing their opponents of being Russian agents, and not enough time talking about other essential issues, the dismantling of health care and other important social programs. Their current strategy is a losing one, and if they continue with it, we could very well be looking at 8 years of President Trump.

[DEM]

Speaking of polls, the Democratic Party as a whole is now less popular than Trump, Pence, the GOP as a whole, and the corporate media. The ones that they narrowly beat out in this poll were Hillary Clinton and congress as a whole. Pretty bad. They simply haven't learned from their defeat. At this point, the Democratic Party establishment appears incapable of even a symbolic change in direction, for example by nomination of Keith Ellison as head of DNC (instead, they again went with the corporate candidate, Hillary Clinton/Barack Obama favorite Tom Perez). Additionally, in my opinion, the democratic party is spending too much time accusing their opponents of being Russian agents, and not enough time talking about other essential issues, the dismantling of health care and other important social programs. Their current strategy is a losing one, and if they continue with it, we could very well be looking at 8 years of President Trump.

More polls:

http://www.businessinsider.com/most-pop ... oll-2017-3

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... atic-party

If you look at the numbers, Bernie Sanders is the most popular politician in America – and it’s not even close. Yet bizarrely, the Democratic party – out of power across the country and increasingly irrelevant – still refuses to embrace him and his message. It’s increasingly clear they do so at their own peril.

A new Fox News poll out this week shows Sanders has a +28 net favorability rating among the US population, dwarfing all other elected politicians on both ends of the political spectrum. And he’s even more popular among the vaunted “independents”, where he is at a mind boggling +41.

This poll is not just an aberration. Look at this Huffington Post chart that has tracked Sanders’ favorability rating over time, ever since he gained national prominence in 2015 when he started running for the Democratic nomination. The more people got to know him, they more they liked him – the exact opposite of what his critics said would happen when he was running against Clinton.

One would think with numbers like that, Democratic politicians would be falling all over themselves to be associated with Sanders, especially considering the party as a whole is more unpopular than the Republicans and even Donald Trump right now. Yet instead of embracing his message, the establishment wing of the party continues to resist him at almost every turn, and they seem insistent that they don’t have to change their ways to gain back the support of huge swaths of the country.

[eldonabe]

Bernie will be taking a dirt nap before he gets another chance at the big chair. The guy is like 90 years old..... not really but he is too old.

[DEM]

If you think that the only significance of the poll numbers is to say that Bernie will be president in 2020 (who knows if he will even run), then I think you missed the bigger point, which is that people are craving authenticity in their candidates, ones that stand for principles and not just their corporate donors. That's why Bernie, at least as far as progressives go, is relatively popular not just among democrats, but also independents and even some republicans that voted Trump. If democrats don't get that memo and embrace similar principles, then we could very well be looking at 8 years of Trump.

[DEM]

Exactly. They are essentially paid to lose.

[Quann]

Any reasonable thoughts on what to do in Syria besides stand idly by and watch atrocity after atrocity happen like we have for the last five years while Assad and Putin keep flexing their muscles? I'm asking because I really don't know at this point. You've got an awful, appalling government regime on one side and then you have a bunch of Islamic mutant animals at the other extreme. The rest of the good people in Syria are left in the middle with no real hope right now. It really is depressing to watch and try to imagine the nightmare that these people are living day to day. This is the first true test of the Trump presidency.

[njumass08]

^ It's a mess. You get rid of Assad and Daesh takes over, but if you don't get rid of Assad you get chemical attacks on children. Both are horrible options.

[InnervisionsUMASS]

Just stay out. It's an awful thing to suggest, but getting involved will only make things worse for the US.

[TheInsider]

Our last captain kept drawing red lines as innocent people got gased.. that being said any more action by our new captain may lead into a proxy war with russia.. hello 1980's Afghanistan. There is no good answer. Unfortunately that whole society is about 500 years behind the rest of the world and that's a hard thing to change.

[njumass08]

Unfortunately that whole society is about 500 years behind the rest of the world and that's a hard thing to change.

Are we talking about Mississippi?