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FRDreams
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Post by FRDreams » Wed Feb 04, 2004 10:25 am

I have been very critical about Lap all season. I like many others was outraged with our cupcake loses. Our schedule was created to win these games and we did not early in the season but we our now and I am happier because of it. Do I think Lap is the best coach for our team? Probably not. However, I will not root against the minutemen so he can get fired. I question many of his in game coaching calls and it was by accident (Gabes injury) that he put this very productive lineup on the floor. Before the win streak I had been wondering what the players thought of Lap and had they given up on him. After watching the URI game and listening to the others I feel they are still playing very hard and fighting every game until the end. The team lacked confindence and they are starting to gain it game by game. At the URI game they were playing with emotion and energy on both sides of the floor. I am happy for the players and hope they continue to improve. I am going to make the trip out west to see the Dayton game. Go Zoomass!

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Post by UMass87 » Wed Feb 04, 2004 10:27 am

twisters tavern wrote:I do want the players to win as many games as possible. I just want to hold Lappas accountable for the horrible losses the team has incurred the pat 2+ seasons. I also want to bring in a coach that will help these players win a ton more games than Lappas has.

Once again, what is wrong with indentifying the positive steps the players are taking and support them, while also criticizing the coaching staff for past poor performances and for a lack of vision for the future?
Nothing. In my book, the team would have to win almost all of the remaining games to vindicate the coach. I missed the game last night but I am convinced the previous three wins were, in large part, due to the play of Viggs at the 4. Given what a great defensive contribution Lee has made at the 4, it is understandable that Lappas was playing him over Viggs at the 4. What suprises me is that midway through Viggs second season, Lappas is just figuring out that Viggs is better suited to the 4 than the 3. It can't just be about height - UMass has been outrebounded by shorter teams numerous times during Lappas' tenure.

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Post by Wiggum » Wed Feb 04, 2004 10:37 am

I think everyone should react however they want to react. If this recent run of play has people encouraged about the direction of the program, that's wonderful, I hope you can get 9,492 others to agree with you. Winning beats the snot out of losing and I think all UMass fans are happy that UMass surprisingly beat Temple and URI and relieved that Rider and Fordham haven't been added to the list of embarassing losses over the past three years.

However, if this recent run which has been spurred by events beyond the coach's control has served to reinforce your feelings that this program is always going to underachieve as long as he's in charge and that these victories are a result of talent overcoming a lack of preperation and instruction, then that's fine too. These haven't been difficult opponents and this is his third year at the helm. It's justifiable to be of the opinion that if beating a MAAC team qualifies as a "great win" for an A-10 program with the national aspirations it alleged to have when it removed the previous coach, then something has gone dreadfully wrong and a change is needed.

One thing I have learned by posting in this forum in its various incarnations since 1995, is that you aren't going to change anyone's mind by campaigning relentlessly for one side or the other. If someone praises the coach, a fan who disagrees shouldn't take it as a personal affront and feel compelled to counter simply to ensure the contrarian point of view is introduced into the thread. If someone is critical of the program's performance over the past 2.5 seasons, it doesn't mean that they're bitter, miserable or preferring UMass to lose to further a personal agenda. It just means that based on the performance (and his previous track record) they don't believe Steve Lappas is the right man to lead this program. Because it is actually possible that he isn't.

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Post by delkins » Wed Feb 04, 2004 10:40 am

I do not get the sense from anyone involved in UMass Athletics that mediocre is a goal for the UMass Basketball Team. I think that although most staffing decisions take time, that the first task for the new AD will be to decide if this season is the start of something bigger and better. The consensus among fans is that this season is not a start of something bigger and better and I believe that everyone involved is very aware of that fact.

Used to be VOR
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Post by Used to be VOR » Wed Feb 04, 2004 10:41 am

UMass87 wrote:I must admit that I don't get how anyone on this board could not want UMass to win. If this team keeps winning then Lappas will have proven many of his critics, like me, wrong. Good for him - and more important - good for UMass.
Said even better than I said it..... great concise post!

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whiterhino42
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Post by whiterhino42 » Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:08 am

I've heard a lot about our week OCC schedule, and I agree compared to the scheds we used to play it was week but I still think it was decent compared to the other A10 schools and of course the big east. I mean we did play UCONN and Boston College along with Texas Tech and Tennessee. Those are 4 quality programs, if you look at a lot of the other schools they didn't play that many quality schools (some did of course). Yes we also played Vermont and Albany but hey those are schools from our area and a LOT of other schools do the same thing. Of course once we turn the corner I'd like to see more quality programs on the slate but compared to the others our sched wasn't really that bad, we just have higher standards as compared to others.

Wiggum
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Post by Wiggum » Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:40 am

The average RPI of the 9 teams UMass has beaten is 171.4.

THE ZOO
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Post by THE ZOO » Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:52 am

The consensus among fans is that this season is not a start of something bigger and better and I believe that everyone involved is very aware of that fact.
Delkins i'm going to have to disagree with this comment. How can you or anyone say that this season is not the start of something bigger and better? We have 5 first year players playing at the division 1 level and they are now starting to figure out what it means to play. We will have lee coming back along with forward Lawrence Carrier. With lee and carrier we will have a solid 9 man rotation and if the other new guys give us anything we will be in great shape. This will be the best returning team we have had in a while.

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Post by Used to be VOR » Wed Feb 04, 2004 12:05 pm

Just FYI - Vermont was an NCAA tournament team last year that was returning all its key players. So, they were not a cupcake.

eldonabe
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Post by eldonabe » Wed Feb 04, 2004 12:16 pm

Wiggum you f-ing a-hole!!!!!!!

How many times are you going to use the same arguments that were used when Bruiser was the coach!!! Jesus Man.

What a revelation! Surprising wins over Temple and URI only allude to how they could play after the many bad losses they had this year!!!!!!!!!!

What about the year that they lost to Iona, Fordham (at home), Marshall, and Holy Cross, but Managed a win against (top 10) Kansas - You ignorant fool! You ripped me an a few others for making that exact point about 5 years ago!

Oh I'm sorry a drop in attendance from capacity to 4,500 was OK but to drop from 4,500 down to only 2,500 - NOW THERE IS A PROBLEM! So let me get this straight - if Bruiser's attendance had dropped below - say - 3,000 then you would have asked for his head???

BE CONSISTENT YOU DIPSCHIDT

I agree that Steve Lappas has not held his end of the bargain and should not coach next year.

Actually I also have absolutely no argument about yous assessment of those wins and the fact that it proves he should be doing better, but remember all of the crap you spewed to defend St. Bruiser - and the statements that you were losing your cool over you miserable hippocritic dick head!

You have taken almost every single criticism that was made of Bruiser and inserted Lappas's name.

HAVE A NICE DAY!


And one more thing - How many seasons did Bruiser have a bad start and pull it out to have a respectable (on paper) finish? ALL 5 YEARS! This season could end up just like that! IF Lappas "earns" another season because of a decent finsh after a horrendous start - then he should be fired if they have a slow start again next year because it wil be another "Bruiser-esque" performance!
Last edited by eldonabe on Wed Feb 04, 2004 12:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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twisters tavern
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Post by twisters tavern » Wed Feb 04, 2004 12:44 pm

I mean we did play UCONN and Boston College along with Texas Tech and Tennessee.

UCONN is a traditional game and we still have not won one against them. If you ask me, playing against them and losing hurts the program more than simply playing against them. Lappas inherited this game.

BC, same thing, a traditional game. We have not beat these guys is a while. Lappas inherited this game.

Texas Tech -- we were in a tournament, so our opponent was picked for us. Oh, and by the way, we suffered one of the worst losses in program history against this team.

Tennessee -- Home and Home. Good selection. We lost to them twice, looking bad on both occasions on national television.

Four losses, one that can be considered a stretch as "good". If he wasn't contractually obligated to play the UCONN & BC games, would Lappas have scheduled them, a comparable team, or Buffalo and Hartwick?

Now the rest of the schedule:
St. Francis -- Preseason NIT Tournament selection. We had no say.
CCSU -- Two years, two losses
Hartford -- Big Loss
Vermont -- Yes a 2003 NCAA Tourney participant, but a 15 seed in that same tournament, and it was there first trip there. They are in a weak conference.
Marshall -- we play them only because of F@$@#n Marcum
Albany -- Horrible
Maine -- much better hockey team, basketball sucks.
Rider -- Again, a mid-level MAAC team.

This was a creampuff schedule that Lappas clearly owns with the exception of the BC, UCONN, and Preseason NIT game which he had no control of. We finished 6-6 against a weak OOC schedule.

A "fair" expectation would have been 8-0 against the much weaker teams, and at least get one of the top four games. If this would have happened, we could have survived the Duquesne, LaSalle, and St. Bonnie's slip up. Lappas couldn't even take advantage of a favored OOC schedule to make up for his deficiencies in conference.

Let's face it. This team has underachieved these past few years. This is a good 4 game winning streak for the players, but for the coaching staff, the prior results speak volumes of how poor the staff really is.

Regardless if we finish even close to .500, Lappas has to go... for the good of the FUTURE of the program. New "quality" AD, New "Quality" Football coach, new "Quality" Basketball coach ... this is a recipr for success.

GO UMASS!

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Old Cage
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Post by Old Cage » Wed Feb 04, 2004 12:46 pm

"The consensus among fans is that this season is not a start of something bigger and better and I believe that everyone involved is very aware of that fact."

Good grief! Slow those brain cells down and read what delkins said!

He said that the folks involved understand that most fans think that this season is not the start of something bigger and better.

That's the consensus I certainly get reading the crap spewed here every day.

ZOO - My take is that he completely agreed with you!

Wiggum
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Post by Wiggum » Wed Feb 04, 2004 1:06 pm

Eldon, the difference is that Bruiser was and is a better coach.

Cheers.

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Post by isithow? » Wed Feb 04, 2004 1:08 pm

OK, so what you all are saying that if the team wins it's just the players sheer talent that is causing it. Yet when the team loses and the players play poorly it has nothing to do with them and all to do with the coaches? :roll: Makes sense to me. :roll:

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InnervisionsUMASS
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Post by InnervisionsUMASS » Wed Feb 04, 2004 1:11 pm

Wiggum wrote:Eldon, the difference is that Bruiser was and is a better coach.

Cheers.

either that or bruiser was milking all that talent that cal brought in
Stop waiting for UMass to do something big and help UMass do something big. - Shades

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