Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Anything and everything that is UMass Minutemen Basketball.
69MG
Hall of Fame
Posts: 7842
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:07 pm
Location: Western Mass

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by 69MG » Sat Dec 31, 2016 12:46 am

It's taken me this long to decompress. I was so pissed when I left the game I couldn't figure out what I disliked most about the game. Now that I've had time to look at the box score and rehash a few things I don't feel quite as bad. SBU is one of the few teams we play who can run with us and let's face it, they shoot the ball a lot better than we do.

There are a hundred things to look at, but I'll stick to three:
1. We have more size than most teams we play and we have to find a way to take advantage of it. Gresham has to start and play alongside Rashaan. It will shore up our weak interior defense and help our rebounding.

2. Our guys have to learn how to drive, and when challenged take a jump stop and shoot a 6 footer (they also have to make them). SBU did it at least 6 times today.

3. Don't press teams that can easily break the press and let them get easy baskets if we don;t end up fouling them 50 feet from the basket.

Some of this is on the coaches and some on the players. The positives I take out of this are that our freshmen now see how the intensity ramps up in conference play and also what happens when opposing coaches know how you play and game plan for it. We'll see if they grow from this. The other positive was the play of Baldwin. It's only 1 game but he has earned an opportunity to play a bigger role. Let's see if he can do it again.

User avatar
Marshmont_63
Senior
Posts: 1060
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:56 pm
Location: Chestnut Hill

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by Marshmont_63 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:58 am

Well, this was disappointing to say the least. I was screaming my head off at certain points in the game, so if you saw someone who looked way too into a game of this magnitude it was most likely me :lol: A few things I noticed today:

1) Pipkins had a horrible game. He was 0-7 from the field and had 0 points.
2) Adams is gifted. He will be playing in the NBA at some point. His drives to the hoop were very "Chaz-esque." Granted, he was always in control, whereas Chaz was out-of-control most of the time. That being said, I was amazed by his finishing ability at the rim.
3) Our press is disastrous. It was half-hearted at best, and it often resulted in 2 on 1's or 3 on 2's for the Bonnies. Why we continue to press is beyond me. It simply doesn't work for us.
4) Baldwin needs more playing time. 9 points and 9 rebounds in 12 minutes. He was a monster on the glass for us. Can't wait to see him in 2 or 3 years.
5) We rarely ever take jump shots inside the arc (or so it seems). I noticed that SBU was getting a lot of their early points off 10 to 15 foot jumpers. They also had some nice drives where their guards would put up floaters. I just feel like we never take short jump shots. It's either a layup, dunk or 3-pointer. Maybe I just haven't noticed it, but it just seems that way.
6) We need to fire DK. I know it won't happen, but it should. I'm not basing this off of this game alone. DK just isn't a good coach of the game. He can recruit, sure. But he just can't deliver results. It's the same shit warmed over every game against good opponents. Our half-court offense is woeful. Perimeter passing with very little movement. That doesn't lead to anything productive. We clearly have talent, but imagine what Schmidt could do here. Honestly, what is our ceiling with DK? Maybe a March Madness appearance with maybe 1 win in it? That shouldn't be the goal of our basketball program. We need a coach who can lead us to the final four. I know that's a lofty expectation, and that it'll be a rare event, but I feel like it's impossible with DK at the helm. I hope I'm wrong about this, but DK hasn't given me or this fanbase much to get excited about in terms of actual game play. Schmidt, and many other coaches around the country, do so much more with less.

To anyone who doesn't think DK should be fired, you could very well be right. I know it's been 7 hours since the game ended, but I still haven't settled down (in terms of emotions) from this game. I just want this program to flourish, and I honestly can't see that happening under DK. Maybe some of you can, but right now I can't.
“When people come to our building we want them to feel the house of P.A.I.N.” -- Chaz Williams

User avatar
Old Cage
Hall of Fame
Posts: 5584
Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2003 8:49 pm
Location: The Eastern Provinces

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by Old Cage » Sat Dec 31, 2016 7:26 am

One simple fact - mentioned by Wiscstlatlmia a few pages back and a few others: our freshman guards were overwhelmed. They shot 3 for 15, Deeky at the point had only one assist, and they were playing against maybe the best guy they have ever faced. This will take some time.

Best stat of the day: Chris Baldwin - 9 boards in 12 minutes.

It was nice to have a moment with Tim Kenney.
"Jack didn’t have any envy in him," Calipari said. "He was the greatest coach to ever coach here."

TheInsider
Hall of Fame
Posts: 2998
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2003 9:12 am

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by TheInsider » Sat Dec 31, 2016 8:16 am

Let's face it, DK doesn't get a lot of help outside Shyrone. He needs to surround himself with some solid basketball people, not a couple of ex Waterboys and an executive.

mlaconte459
Hall of Fame
Posts: 2824
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:24 pm

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by mlaconte459 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 8:50 am

Our only hope for success is to go big and pound the ball down low.. it seems obvious that's is our strength and the game plan we should use.. run off ball screens to free up the bigs.. the question is, can DK adjust to this obvious strategy
GO... GO U... GO UMASSS..... GO UMASSS

TheInsider
Hall of Fame
Posts: 2998
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2003 9:12 am

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by TheInsider » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:11 am

^^^ agree 100%.. for the first time we have multiple bigs that are talented and can score... we should be an inside out team right now.. DK has never been a guy to feed the bigs. I think we've done a better job at it tough this year than in the past. I hope he keeps doing it. If we go back to chucking 3's and 1on1, we will be lucky to be .500 in the conf.

User avatar
Floyd
Hall of Fame
Posts: 6247
Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 8:50 am
Location: Not where I should be

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by Floyd » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:47 am

I agree with the comments about going big a bit more. Yesterday was tough though with Malik getting hurt and Brison bounced. Baldwin needs to get into the regular rotation, with more time, I think he'll improve each game. You can tell he hates to lose
Killed me to see Brison get ejected, but I love that he isn't afraid to mix it up. Both he and Baldwin go after everything on the glass and I love that

What happened with Holloway late second half? He was our most effective inside scorer all game but he sat on the bench for a long stretch
Should have abandoned the press early as their guards are very good, broke the press easily, and had many layups or easy inside buckets once they broke it
Schmidt clearly had them ready to go and manages the game very well. Guy can flat out coach. Wish we had him.
Jaylen Adams is a joy to watch. Kid can play the game

Have to say, major shitshow with slow ticket lines and concessions. Coming in they had 2 frickin ticket scanners. Took 10 minutes to get thru the door. Lines outside for buying/picking up tickets looked like 200 yds long. 1 register open at concessions, no food ready right before halftime. People were bitching that it was a waste of time with getting in and waiting and heard several say they would never come back. Shitty game experience for new fans and getting outplayed in front of the seasons best crowd can't happen. I realize it's break, but they had to expect a decent crowd and we're not ready

Go Big or Go Home
The E sho, best show in town

tdmass
Senior
Posts: 1212
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:40 am
Location: Ormond Beach,Florida

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by tdmass » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:50 am

Kellogg is a puzzling coach to say the least. Why isn't his offense from the inside out . . . what made him think we have a good 3 pt shooting team when evidence suggests otherwise? His teaching of the press with these talented/athletic players is terrible! I'm just thinking out loud if these 2 coaches were reversed .. . DK with very little facilities to attract good players in a desolate location would starve! Schmidt, who seems to find talent that is always under the radar would flourish! Nobody heard of Jalen Adams until he arrived in Olean . . . not a top 100 or even 200. Then this kid Mobley is 50 miles up the street and looking to transfer, I guess about the same time Zach Lewis was looking, who was a better judge of talent? And I'm not saying Lewis isn't a good get or that Mobley was interested but Schmidt has been doing this with unheralded players for quite some time now! Like I said earlier I don't know why BC passed on him but somebody will very, very soon!

Berkman
Hall of Fame
Posts: 5191
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 2:38 pm
Location: Mooresville, NC
Contact:

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by Berkman » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:31 am

Floyd wrote:I
Have to say, major shitshow with slow ticket lines and concessions. Coming in they had 2 frickin ticket scanners. Took 10 minutes to get thru the door. Lines outside for buying/picking up tickets looked like 200 yds long. 1 register open at concessions, no food ready right before halftime. People were bitching that it was a waste of time with getting in and waiting and heard several say they would never come back. Shitty game experience for new fans and getting outplayed in front of the seasons best crowd can't happen. I realize it's break, but they had to expect a decent crowd and we're not ready

Go Big or Go Home
It is terrible having to wait in line when they only are using a couple ticket takers. Hey if you are standing in line outside you are not spending money inside. Same goes for long slow lines at the concessions at the BB and FB games.

I went to Lebanon Valley Speedway just about every Sat night for 48 years and they had the very best concession setup of any sport places I have ever attended. First of all they had a $ 1 policy at all of the concession stands. They had a change booth and you had to change larger bills to $ 1 bills.( Promoter's idea to reduce potential thefts) There were separate lines with money collectors with a deep box for the money for just about every item that was sold, hot dogs/kielbasa dogs, hot sausage and meatball grinders, french fries, pizza, pop corn, coffee and hot chocolate, fried dough, baked beans and nacho cheese, soda, ice cream, and beer. Lines moved pretty quick even during intermission. Many nights the crowd would be over 8,000 and on special events over 10,000.

UMass would never do that because they have no idea on how to accommodate people quickly and would not listen to inputs from outsiders.

minutefanjsf
Senior
Posts: 1556
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2016 9:17 am

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by minutefanjsf » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:48 am

Here's my take on this DK coach talk. He is not as good as Schmidt or about half maybe more of the A10 coaches. So, he has to rely on better talent to bail him out. DK is not God awful. This current team is very young and needs direction in fundamentals before they master any offensive or defensive schemes or sets. Many of the turnovers are on passes that shouldn't be attempted or even travels. They are getting better at this, except for yesterday, maybe? Flowers was forced to play too much yesterday, he was a liability both offensively and on the press. DK pulled guards who made mistakes and they were coached in the bench. He didn't or couldn't pull Flowers much due to Brison and Hines not available. DK was constantly redirecting Flowers on the offensive end to finish his cuts and where to be to spread the floor. As to playing inside out, our guards and wings can't seem to recognize when our bigs are open. Our bigs work too hard to not get fed the ball. Our guards also do not make the extra pass when the drive a seam in a zone and draw the D to them leaving a block open. I attribute these to youth and adjusting to the college game. Deeky makes at least 3 passes per game and 2 plays that were probably successful in HS, but have no shot in D1 hoops.

User avatar
econalum
Senior
Posts: 1702
Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2003 10:31 am
Location: Acton, MA

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by econalum » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:49 am

Sounds like UMASS did things 'on the cheap' and had no plan if people actually showed up to a game. That is a missed opportunity for sure. And, there is nothing worse for a parent that waiting in lines with impatient grade schoolers.
Feeling entitled is JUST a feeling...

Almontis
Junior
Posts: 667
Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2004 1:23 am
Location: Massachusetts

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by Almontis » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:17 am

I agree with you, minutefanjsf. I like this core group, and I think DK can do well with them. Deeky is much more talented than CJ, but CJ runs the offense better because he's experienced. I'd like to see more Gresham and Baldwin together -- much more. I think Holloway should be used more strategically, as in some PnR situations but not as much of a focal point. We need better rebounding, rotations, and rim protection -- to say nothing of the disappearing 10-15 ft jump shot.

I hope the perimeter shooting comes around, & I'm curious what the staff is doing to address this now and for next season.

I don't know how many A10 teams we're going to rattle with our full court pressure. It'll be interesting to see how effective our team defense is over the next handful of games.
Last edited by Almontis on Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:23 am, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
Swampy
Hall of Fame
Posts: 4118
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2003 9:21 am
Contact:

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by Swampy » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:18 am

tdmass wrote:^Scmidt forgot more BB than DK knows.
I let the last one go but this is the second post about how GREAT Schmidt is and how much better he is than DK. Dude is okay but he's not the second coming of John Wooden, imo.

Fact:
He's ten years older than DK
Fact:
He had six years as Head Coach at Bobby Morris where he never really set the world on fire. (82-90)
Fact:
His record since moving to Olean and joining the A-10 is 146-132 with a conference record of 70-78
Fact:
His overall record after fifteen plus years of coaching is 228-222
Fact:
He's been to the NCAAs once in fifteen years as a head coach.
Fact:
He's a BC alum
Fact:
He has won some games against Kellogg coached UMass teams.

69MG
Hall of Fame
Posts: 7842
Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:07 pm
Location: Western Mass

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by 69MG » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:22 am

This is the best view I have come across of the "incident". Maybe I'm a homer, but I don't think Brison should get suspended for this.
https://twitter.com/PJStevens10/status/ ... 6870213632

minutefanjsf
Senior
Posts: 1556
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2016 9:17 am

Re: Game 14, 2016-17: St. Bonaventure (12/30)

Post by minutefanjsf » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:32 am

Swampy wrote:
tdmass wrote:^Scmidt forgot more BB than DK knows.
I let the last one go but this is the second post about how GREAT Schmidt is and how much better he is than DK. Dude is okay but he's not the second coming of John Wooden, imo.

Fact:
He's ten years older than DK
Fact:
He had six years as Head Coach at Bobby Morris where he never really set the world on fire. (82-90)
Fact:
His record since moving to Olean and joining the A-10 is 146-132 with a conference record of 70-78
Fact:
His overall record after fifteen plus years of coaching is 228-222
Fact:
He's been to the NCAAs once in fifteen years as a head coach.
Fact:
He's a BC alum
Fact:
He has won some games against Kellogg coached UMass teams.

Thanks for the facts Swampy. Even as a BC alum he was not hired at BC. He has been able to get his guys to do what he wants. DK hasn’t yet.

Post Reply