Salary aside that would be a lateral move at best for most on that list. Pretty lofty expectations IMORefuse2Lose83 wrote:From PrepsScouting on twitter:
Some Early Names for Memphis:
Gregg Marshall
Archie Miller
Bruce Pearl
Andy Kennedy
Kevin Keatts
Derek Kellogg
Kenny Payne
Penny Hardaway
Barbee coaching
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
JoleonLescottsHair wrote:Sounds vaguely familiar.NilesGold wrote:The only reason Pastner was still at Memphis was his huge buyout.
HE CANT READ YOU ✌
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Either the info I had before was bad, or I misunderstood it, because Memphis is actually paying Pastner $1.25M. I wonder if GT made this move at least partially out of financial concerns. I know they're still paying for Gregory who they just fired and I think they still have to pay for Paul Hewitt. Paying for three men's basketball head coaches at the same time can't be cheap.NilesGold wrote:I still can't believe that GT hired Pastner away from Memphis. The only reason Pastner was still at Memphis was his huge buyout. But instead of paying something like a $10M buyout to get rid of Pastner, Memphis is actually going to get paid $500k. Crazy.
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Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Georgia Tech still owes Paul Hewitt $3.6 million. Hewitt also has $750K coming to him from George Mason. Damn, that is some serious unemployment comp. Not sure how schools like Tech or GMU are finding ways to do these buyouts, but I wish UMass would learn the trick.
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Memphis fans would revolt if they went after Kellogg. Geez Louise, I know Pastner has his faults, but he's like John Wooden compared to DK. While DK was being turned into an automaton point guard by Coach Cal in the 1990s, Pastner was playing for Arizona AND coaching his own AAU teams. No joke - look it up.
One guy's a coaching lifer; the other just fell into it because he couldn't think of anything better to do.
https://arizona.rivals.com/content.asp? ... CID=528337
One guy's a coaching lifer; the other just fell into it because he couldn't think of anything better to do.
https://arizona.rivals.com/content.asp? ... CID=528337
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Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Oh no I'm just realizing this foe button is going to make for some times where there are redundant posts for the innocent 3rd parties like the rest of us because they can't see each other's posts.
I love how "experts" keep throwing Marshall and Miller's names out there for any open job. Those guys aren't leaving until something worth while opens up.
I love how "experts" keep throwing Marshall and Miller's names out there for any open job. Those guys aren't leaving until something worth while opens up.
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Now are you going to tell me that DK inherited the same talent that Pastner inherited? Memphis is known as a hotbed for basketball talent, an outstanding facility in the Fedex Forum, supported by Smith (CEO of FedEx), and all Pastner could do was win the Conference USA? The players hated Pastner as evidenced by the players that transferred and were scheduled to transfer, and quotes in the Memphis Commercial Appeal by past players. Also, were you aware that DK was offered the Memphis job prior to Pastner?MikeEsq wrote:Memphis fans would revolt if they went after Kellogg. Geez Louise, I know Pastner has his faults, but he's like John Wooden compared to DK. While DK was being turned into an automaton point guard by Coach Cal in the 1990s, Pastner was playing for Arizona AND coaching his own AAU teams. No joke - look it up.
One guy's a coaching lifer; the other just fell into it because he couldn't think of anything better to do.
https://arizona.rivals.com/content.asp? ... CID=528337
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
I was aware that DK was offered the job before Pastner, and I don't see any way he could have gotten the Tigers to four consecutive NCAA appearances the way Pastner did. DK might be a better "face of the program," but get poorer results, if you catch my drift. Anybody after Coach Cal at Memphis was going to pale in comparison unless they won the national championship, since Cal did everything but (OT loss to Kansas).
Reading the article below corroborates everything you said. Pastner seems to me to be the type of X and O savant who is short on people/player relationship skills from the sounds of it. But I'm not sure how many more wins that gets you, either.
DK seems like he wants to be everyone's buddy most of the time, when he needs to be kicking players in the ass (metaphorically) more and not settling for mediocrity. And he needs to do a true top to bottom evaluation of the program. Sounds like Pastner fired too many people; UMass basketball might benefit if DK took a more critical look at some of his own support staff. In any event, an interesting contrast to discuss on the board.
http://www.commercialappeal.com/sports/ ... 72181.html
Reading the article below corroborates everything you said. Pastner seems to me to be the type of X and O savant who is short on people/player relationship skills from the sounds of it. But I'm not sure how many more wins that gets you, either.
DK seems like he wants to be everyone's buddy most of the time, when he needs to be kicking players in the ass (metaphorically) more and not settling for mediocrity. And he needs to do a true top to bottom evaluation of the program. Sounds like Pastner fired too many people; UMass basketball might benefit if DK took a more critical look at some of his own support staff. In any event, an interesting contrast to discuss on the board.
http://www.commercialappeal.com/sports/ ... 72181.html
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
I think it's pretty clear that DK is a players coach and that guys like playing for him, but how do you know what DK does/says behind closed doors? You do realize the part of the program you actually see is probably less than 5% of the stuff that goes on year round right?MikeEsq wrote: DK seems like he wants to be everyone's buddy most of the time, when he needs to be kicking players in the ass (metaphorically) more and not settling for mediocrity. And he needs to do a true top to bottom evaluation of the program. Sounds like Pastner fired too many people; UMass basketball might benefit if DK took a more critical look at some of his own support staff. In any event, an interesting contrast to discuss on the board.
http://www.commercialappeal.com/sports/ ... 72181.html
Mullins Militia President (2011-2014)
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
I go by what I do see. And I see a lot of mediocrity. Therefore, I conclude that the head of the program accepts mediocrity.
Players screw up in the games (e.g., stupid 3-point shooting), and they aren't usually pulled for their transgressions. From that, I see a lack of accountability.
Players screw up in the games (e.g., stupid 3-point shooting), and they aren't usually pulled for their transgressions. From that, I see a lack of accountability.
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Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Hard to argue. But if mediocrity is indeed good enough, it is not just head of the program. It extends to the overall fan base, student population, the alumni, and is all reflected in the media coverage. Of course the coach, fans, and administration want to win, but it is obviously just not that urgent. That's the problem. Nice if it happens, but no big deal if the program just slugs along. Middling around with an occasional decent season is enough for the full range of UMass hoop interests. That has become very clear.MikeEsq wrote:I go by what I do see. And I see a lot of mediocrity. Therefore, I conclude that the head of the program accepts mediocrity.
Wow, really? I don't remember that. Any archved articles discussing this? Who was rumored to replace Kellogg at UMass had he jumped? Just incredible to think a top notch program like Memphis even offered DK, who at that point had one season of experience as a head coach; a season in which he delivered an awful 12-18 record. He chased that with an even worse follow up year, finishing 12-20. Memphis may have grown tired of Paster, but in his 7 years he delivered 4 NCAAs and 1 NIT, 4 24+ win seasons, a 31 win season, an overall .700 winning percentage, and zero losing seasons. Compare that to how disappointing DK has been (3 losing seasons, 2 .500 seasons, a losing record in the A10, and a .540 winning percentage) and those fans should consider themsleves lucky to have dodged that bullet. Wow.albaby wrote:Also, were you aware that DK was offered the Memphis job prior to Pastner?
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Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
I think DK had only been at UMass for a year or two when they offered. I guess though they offered him a ton of cash.
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
Memphis wanted to replace Cal ASAP, offered DK, Dk turned it down, Pastner on the way to Kentucky to join Cal, received offer on the way , accepted and the rest is history. Check the Memphis Commercial Appeal for confirmation.JoleonLescottsHair wrote:Hard to argue. But if mediocrity is indeed good enough, it is not just head of the program. It extends to the overall fan base, student population, the alumni, and is all reflected in the media coverage. Of course the coach, fans, and administration want to win, but it is obviously just not that urgent. That's the problem. Nice if it happens, but no big deal if the program just slugs along. Middling around with an occasional decent season is enough for the full range of UMass hoop interests. That has become very clear.MikeEsq wrote:I go by what I do see. And I see a lot of mediocrity. Therefore, I conclude that the head of the program accepts mediocrity.
Wow, really? I don't remember that. Any archved articles discussing this? Who was rumored to replace Kellogg at UMass had he jumped? Just incredible to think a top notch program like Memphis even offered DK, who at that point had one season of experience as a head coach; a season in which he delivered an awful 12-18 record. He chased that with an even worse follow up year, finishing 12-20. Memphis may have grown tired of Paster, but in his 7 years he delivered 4 NCAAs and 1 NIT, 4 24+ win seasons, a 31 win season, an overall .700 winning percentage, and zero losing seasons. Compare that to how disappointing DK has been (3 losing seasons, 2 .500 seasons, a losing record in the A10, and a .540 winning percentage) and those fans should consider themsleves lucky to have dodged that bullet. Wow.albaby wrote:Also, were you aware that DK was offered the Memphis job prior to Pastner?
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
what could have been...
Re: Barbee and UTEP/Auburn
^ You think McCutcheon would've done a good job hiring DK's replacement?